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Dimensional 'Submarines'

HAMnJAM

The Ham Lord
Inactive Member
So, I had this awkward fever dream of a vessel in the Star Army universe that I feel has not been explored or has been explored and I never knew about it. Basically, a submarine that 'submerges' itself in the space in between dimensions and acts like a submarine in space.

Here are some notes that I wrote up and express my general thoughts on functionality:

Basically, it's a submarine in space. Using some convoluted ballast device from a modified dimensional transportation system, the 'sub' submerges in the dimensional rifts in between the primary dimension and an unnamed other. This 'sub' will probably be the rough length of 250 meters and not extremely wide.

Now the begging question that I know is possibly in your mind, 'But Ham! How does one detect the vessel so it isn't a hunt and kill thing?'

Simple, the 'sub' has to be at periscope depth to fire torpedoes with certainty. And at periscope depth, the sensors arrays, sights, and vision apertures are literally sticking out of a dimensional pocket. If one is looking for abnormalities, they will see this rift. Besides the rift, the ship is nearly undetectable.

The torpedoes are somewhat similar. The torpedoes are fired from forward and/or aft tubes, and after roughly 150 meters move back into the fabric of the primary dimension at near sublight speeds and reach running speed (via slowing down and gaining signal to target) roughly eight to sixteen seconds after 'dephase' period.

The other obvious question, 'how to do destroy it,' can be accomplished in a multitude of ways. If you find a way to catch the submarine when it's 'surfaced,' you can obviously destroy it conventionally. If it's 'submerged,' and you destroy it's periscopes it will be unable to fire it's torpedoes with any real means of accuracy, leading to a retreat. Lastly, if the sucker is 'submerged' and you really, really, need to blow it up, find a way to send something to the dimensional pocket's seam, and detonate. The stabilizer assemblies on the periscope react poorly when actually hit, and have the possibility of ripping the submarine to the primary dimension along with a violent expulsion from the vessel's dimensional shielding. After this expulsion, the 'sub' is completely 'surfaced' and most likely damaged.

With that wall of text out of the way, I'd welcomely appreciate feedback and opinions on this subject.
 
Actually, here's an idea for dual propulsion:

Have standard engines for use in the prime dimension, but require a different form of propulsion for this alternate dimension - let's call it the subdimension. Suppose orthodox propulsion methods don't work, and this alternate propulsion requires inordinate amounts of power. This way, there should would be an actual chance of them getting caught 'surfaced' since their power sources don't have a high enough output for sustained subdimensional travel.

Just an idea XD
 
Holy shit. Like the UX-1 from Space Battleship Yamato? xD

Pretty Much, but with our own twists to make it our own.

Have standard engines for use in the prime dimension, but require a different form of propulsion for this alternate dimension - let's call it the subdimension. Suppose orthodox propulsion methods don't work, and this alternate propulsion requires inordinate amounts of power. This way, there should would be an actual chance of them getting caught 'surfaced' since their power sources don't have a high enough output for sustained subdimensional travel.

That idea is interesting, but the thing about it is to fire the torpedoes the sub must be closest to the primary dimension (Periscope Depth). The sub will most likely be in between with super-nerdy shields keeping the submarine's dimension together.

But your claim of the power sources and eventual surface is clear. It has to surface to recharge the dimensional diving system (similar to using diesels to charge batteries on U-Boats and Other Diesel Boats). The ships sublight engines in conjunction with the modified CFS or a heavily burdened Transuniversal Drive to 'dive' below. Understanding the IC condition and OOC condition of these systems, the TDD drive installed on the submarine will be unable to completely move between dimensions mostly due to IC restraint. Plus, using the diving mechanic, the ship can't travel between dimensions as it will reach 'crush' depth before then where the drive system is under extreme strain of floating between the dimensions in the 'dimensional void' zone. The risk of straying too far into this zone is the threat of the vessel ceasing to exist on the dimensional plane it preexisted on, and being lost in the void forever.

Sort of a balancing act.
 
Perhaps the 'periscope' sensors could be a stepping stone towards something analogous to hydrophones. That way, you could have them 'running silent' in the subdimension, while still being able to detect incoming countermeasures as such transdimensional devices would have a strong energy signature. Additionally, there could be something akin to active and passive sonar, usable for combat scans. After all, sub designers realized quickly that one of the best ways to increase survivability is to minimize surface time.
 
It's a cool idea that's been discussed a few times in the past, but what purpose would a "dimensional submarine" actually serve?

We already have the technology to make scout ships essentially invisible and immune to weapons targeting, so functionally we've achieved the doctrine of "silent running stealth ships that can surprise attack and sneak away" that submarines do.
 
I think our hard to pin down FTL rules basically kill this idea.

Sure you could use your FTL drive to do FTL drive based shananagins, but since you can't use your FTL systems within ~20 light minutes of a planet/starsystem you can't really use this anywhere that is interesting.
 
It's a cool idea that's been discussed a few times in the past, but what purpose would a "dimensional submarine" actually serve?

We already have the technology to make scout ships essentially invisible and immune to weapons targeting, so functionally we've achieved the doctrine of "silent running stealth ships that can surprise attack and sneak away" that submarines do.
The answer is right there. Scout ships. This kind of ship would be able to deal large amounts of damage while retaining a good degree of stealth.
I think our hard to pin down FTL rules basically kill this idea.

Sure you could use your FTL drive to do FTL drive based shananagins, but since you can't use your FTL systems within ~20 light minutes of a planet/starsystem you can't really use this anywhere that is interesting.
If that's the case, then we just find a new method. After all, that's why this thread is here.
 
We already have the technology to make scout ships essentially invisible and immune to weapons targeting, so functionally we've achieved the doctrine of "silent running stealth ships that can surprise attack and sneak away" that submarines do.

Besides said above, I'm attempting to design it to be able to fire while 'submerged.' Along with the rough size improvement, it could potentially be a long-term stealth deployment.

I think our hard to pin down FTL rules basically kill this idea.

That's where it gets interesting. Ship uses conventional FTL methods to enter system. Submerging down and moving around through the 'voidspace' in between is the fun part. I'm not exactly sure how SARP handles the place hypothetically between dimensions. Basically, you are not moving faster than light, you are moving out of the dimension when submerged.

(Might not have helped, but attempting to!)
 
The answer is right there. Scout ships. This kind of ship would be able to deal large amounts of damage while retaining a good degree of stealth.
Scout ships have aether shock arrays that can blow up small planets. Lol.

Don't get me wrong. I think it'd be cool to find some kind of reason to have Space U-Boats™. But I'm not really understanding what they'd be other than a label for stuff we already have.

EDIT: Ham talked about firing while "submerged." That's a neat idea. Pretty powerful, but if you can get it approved then why not? :>
 
Could potentially float it as an alternative option to conventional methods or dip it in with another faction. I understand that Yamatai possess scout vessels with basically the end all, be all of starship weapons. I'm an unsure whether the Scout vessels mentioned have the availability to fire from stealth, and the object of that would end this idea immediately.

In short, this is a vessel that fires from an almost invulnerable plane, but to be balanced OOCly only has heavyweight torpedoes.
 
In short, this is a vessel that fires from an almost invulnerable plane, but to be balanced OOCly only has heavyweight torpedoes.
Alex few point defense weapons couldn't hurt though... could they? I mean, once past the prototype stage, all subs had at least an aa gun or light cannon.
 
Why not just use phasing? Pack some really good navigation systems so you can move confidently while fully phased, and half phase for periscope depth.
 
Why not just use phasing? Pack some really good navigation systems so you can move confidently while fully phased, and half phase for periscope depth.

I will keep that in mind if my idea for inventing voidspace doesn't work. My only thing is can the system be mechanized so we don't have to have red shirt technicians with band-aids?
 
Why not just use phasing? Pack some really good navigation systems so you can move confidently while fully phased, and half phase for periscope depth.

Although @Wes would have to confirm this, I'm fairly certain there was a push a while back to minimize the amount of phasic devices within the setting.
 
@Wes, do you count these two items as unwanted:

Subdimensional Diving Unit: Does not have ability to go in between dimensions, and is directly tied with the SARP dimension and no other dimension

Voidspace: The 'dimension,' or lack thereof, located in between dimensions. Voidspace is only able to be accessed using the Subdimensional unit and is relatively locked to the perceived dimension (dimension user originates from). Almost nothing exists in this area, the only thing technically existing is the sub.
 
The voidspace would be okay only if it was basically just another name for the existing "subspace" I think. I really don't want to add new dimensions to the SARPiverse.

My main concern is that in Star Army, by design, the starship and the power armor are the kings of the setting, and that introducing subs could eventually change the nature of the setting such as how starships do combat, what starships are like, etc. In essence I like the way starships are now and I don't want all those cool battleships and carriers to become obsolete because everyone turns to "sub" warfare.
 
To answer that question, is simply that I am designing it for Yamatai first. And the major item is that they are not going to carry very many torpedoes, not have the armor to sustain very much, and eventually (Pending RP of course) The secret of discovering them be found out.
 
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