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New Submission Language: Opšti

Ametheliana

Sensei
Staff Member
Submissions Reviewer
FM of Nepleslia
FM of the Iromakuanhe
Game Master
I changed it and OP to a wip namespace.
 

Ametheliana

Sensei
Staff Member
Submissions Reviewer
FM of Nepleslia
FM of the Iromakuanhe
Game Master
I don't think this is a beneficial addition to the site, it's just a stub. Can you add to it?
 

Dragon_God

FM of S6
FM of Dovania
Game Master
It's the language used in Dovania, how would it not be an important article to add in the language of a faction?

Did you not on the Azazel Titan Character submission stated to create a wiki article for Opšti?
 

Ametheliana

Sensei
Staff Member
Submissions Reviewer
FM of Nepleslia
FM of the Iromakuanhe
Game Master
Can you add to it? It's not beneficial as is, it's just a few lines. Let me nab some examples of language articles on the wiki, though some of the ones I am thinking of are very extensive and you don't need to go all out like this, but more than you have would be appreciated.
 

Dragon_God

FM of S6
FM of Dovania
Game Master
I mimicked it off of the Trade (Language) article. Is that article not acceptable because it's small?

It has as much content as Yamataigo and Trade, what's the issue?
 

Ametheliana

Sensei
Staff Member
Submissions Reviewer
FM of Nepleslia
FM of the Iromakuanhe
Game Master
Generally, basing new articles off of older ones will lead to an issue like this. Standards change over time and something that was fine five years ago isn't acceptable for a new submission, now.

Here's a nice example where you get to see examples of phrases, structure, vernacular, and rhetoric are touched on, etc:
 

Ametheliana

Sensei
Staff Member
Submissions Reviewer
FM of Nepleslia
FM of the Iromakuanhe
Game Master
Making it a real article and not a stub is necessary for approval.
 
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Dragon_God

FM of S6
FM of Dovania
Game Master
Define a real article then, and if so, then why is Yamatigo and Trade not updated then? It's a simple article that I used the base language off of. Why do I need to copy another faction's language, when Trade is a base and gives the standard. All of the 'common phrases' and 'structure' is in the Wikipedia articles, like Yamataigo and Trade has. I understand that they are older articles. However I don't see the need to change the article if those two are still 'snub'.

You expect me to create the entire article, when the entire Wikipedia article covers it for me. Is that not acceptable? Then why is it still a thing for older articles, and if you're going to make the argument about the older articles, then why are the older articles not updated then?
 
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Ametheliana

Sensei
Staff Member
Submissions Reviewer
FM of Nepleslia
FM of the Iromakuanhe
Game Master
Standards change over time and something that was fine five years ago isn't acceptable for a new submission, now.
I already told you.

There are so many articles on the wiki, I forget if it's tens of thousands or not, but that's so many. Updating older articles as standards change is a lot harder than anyone can do feasibly, so making sure new articles are as they should be is what takes precedent.

I am not here to argue with you, I am here to improve your article with you to get it to the point of approval. If you don't want to do that, I can forego the end result of approval. I think that can be avoided pretty easily if you improve the article, though.
 

Dragon_God

FM of S6
FM of Dovania
Game Master
You're asking me to study a language that I have limited knowledge on and to give a language lesson on it. In which case takes longer than what a simple Wikipedia article can fix. Unless the premises of external links is now not acceptable, then why was that not made clear earlier.

@Wes, Can I get a second opinion on this?

Also, the articles for the languages state that they've been updated 30-31 days ago.
 

Syaoran

Staff Member
Submissions Reviewer
FM of Abwehr
Game Master
Was just gonna interject a little, but since another opinion was called, I'll act in my capacity as a Content and Setting manager.

Ame is correct about this article. As an article it doesn't add anything to the site. You could tack this info onto another page, probably a culture page for the nation, and never make an article. Though if there isn't more to elaborate on it begs the question of why you made a whole different language in the first place for a human based faction in the setting.

Also jsut an FYI, external links do not count as 'content' because they can go down, or be altered, we have no control over them. So linking to them doesn't really count as providing information for a wiki page, because that information isn't guaranteed.
 

Dragon_God

FM of S6
FM of Dovania
Game Master
To answer the question on why there is a completely different language for a Human based faction, I'll ask a question to that. Why does Yamatai speak a different language when they are essentially the same? My actual answer is that despite where you come from, you can be the same species and have different languages.

To get back to the main point, I will update the article page, or just turn it into the culture page. However, this goes back to you basically asking me to write a article on a language that I personally don't have much experience in speaking, let alone reading or having proper grammar. Before you state it, no, I will not change to an already preset language. However, I find it profoundly absurd if you would expect me to make a article such as the Hidden Sun Clan's Language "Takavonai."

I don't deny the information needed to describe the language, and I'm not stating that I will not update or at least pin the article into another article. Merely the point being that if the article is considered a 'Snub' as you call it. Then why is a recently updated article for Trade and Yamataigo still acceptable?
 

Ametheliana

Sensei
Staff Member
Submissions Reviewer
FM of Nepleslia
FM of the Iromakuanhe
Game Master
Thank you, dude!!!

Just a point about the Hidden Sun Clan, I have used that page in RP and it made the RP really fun. For me as a player, it is helpful to look into the wiki if I know I will be RPing with a culture and to say, okay I will try this listed gesture or this listed word and hopefully it will spark some fun RP that otherwise, would be a little more directionless. Remember you are not just making an article for ntse to approve, you are making articles for future players to read! Thank you!

I said stub, not snub.
 

Syaoran

Staff Member
Submissions Reviewer
FM of Abwehr
Game Master
A few other things need to be said here as well. Dragon, you have been told, twice older articles can not be used to justify newer ones. That submission standards have changed. The newer article edits were not NTSE make overs, you have officially been warned, drop that topic or submission privileges will be temporarily suspended.

Also you were not asked to make an article like the HSC's language article, that wasn't even the one used as an example. You were told to simply expound on the article because as it is it offers nothing to the site.

And as for your response about why make another language. That question is an OOC question. If you're not going to bother to put the effort into your language to make it something people can actually RP with why make it in the first place? That's not an insult but a serious question.
 

Wes

Founder & Admin
Staff Member
FM of Yamatai
Game Master
STO Fleet Member
What do you expect me to put in the Trade and Yamataian articles? A list of common English and Japanese phrases like "Where is the bathroom?"

A stub is just an article that's very short and just doesn't give a lot of information, so Ame is asking for it to be beefier or just put the language info on the faction page as a section.
 
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