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Medical Treatment

Wes

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Reviving this from the last forum:

kel said:
There are several of us who play medical officers, and we tend to do it with widely varying styles. Cavane, for example, when treating a patient with broken bones and severe burns across much of their body, gave the patient drugs to lower their blood pressure and thus stem blood loss, requested skin grafts for the burnt area after removing the crunchy bits, and injected her with various substances to help the bones mend before sticking her in the hemosynth tank. In the same situation, I would have assumed that the neko's compartmentalized circulatory system would minimalize the blood loss, removed the crunchy bits, and left the rest to a hemosynthesis tank.

He and I approach the same problem from two very different angles: he used a treatment fairly similar to what would be done in a modern hospital, whereas I'd assume that the hemosynthesis tank would take care of much of it. For any given problem, just about any medical officer is going to treat it differently, because the players all have different ideas about how neko/Yamataian bodies and the medical technology in the setting work.

Take another example: The situation Mara, on the Miharu, is currently in. She took a blast through the chest, destroying her lungs and presumably her MSS organ (presuming she even had one to begin with--neko anatomy is another issue altogether). She also lost a leg, leading to massive blood loss. Since she has no lungs or MSS organ, her breathing and blood replacement are both severely crippled. She's in shock, and has possible spinal injuries.

Now, from my point of view, the best treatment for this would be to rush her the hell to a hemosynth tank, then use it to force oxygen and nutrients through her skin to stabilize her as it repairs her. Other people would probably say this is insane--moving somebody who's in shock runs a risk of killing them. Moving somebody with spinal injuries too quickly can worsen it and paralyze them below the injury. My rebuttal here would be that her compartmentalized blood vessels will probably keep her brain perfused better than a human's would in the same situation, and her internal hemosynthesis will fix up the spinal injuries if she lives. But yet another school could argue that she might be able to respirate enough through her skin to keep herself alive, and that Miyoko could spend as much time on-site giving her blood transfusions as she wanted.

The point I'm trying to make here is this: what one player has their medical officer character do can seem downright nonsensical to others, because we are all approaching medicine in this setting with widely different opinions. It doesn't help that we have varying levels of medical training. So, what I'd like to propose is this: some sort of usergroup or thread for people who play medical officers to get together and discuss the specific cases, so we can reach some kind of consensus on treatments that make sense. It'd also be a good resource for asking the various 'do you think [such-and-such piece of medical technology] exists?' questions.

Wes said:
In a triage situation people who are probably going to die anyway could be allowed to die if needed and later reincarnated via memory backup. For serious but non-fatal injury, nutrient-rich blood the #1 thing a neko needs. For minor injuries, Nekovalkyrja shouldn't even be treated by doctors.

In a non-triage situation, the hemosynthesis tank is really the best thing you can do for a Nekovalkyrja, because they depend on that blood for most function. Blood loss is one of the leading causes of neko death (under antimatter-related trauma). UNder most circumstances the Neko body will fix itself given time and resources.]

Yeah, that's been one of my general assumptions--my cures tend to be fairly quick at getting people into the tank when compared to others', it seems. Particularly since it can also take care of blood loss, detoxification, and oxygenation... it's just about a panacea.

Triage and other situations where 'just stick them in the tank' isn't necessarily an immediate option are where this kind of thing would be more useful.

Yangfan said:
Perhaps we could standardize several styles of healing? I would assume that a Nepleslia-trained doctor would have very different methods and priorities from a Yamatai-trained doctor.

Now, the more chemical / drug-reliant approaches of a Nepleslia-trained doctor might work just fine on Nekos, but a Neko doctor might have a hard time treating Nepleslians, since humans are just so much more fragile than Nekos.

And of course, this is not to suggest that Kel's idea doesn't have merit. I believe that it would be time well spent for the players who RP medics and doctors to get together and "get their story straight".
 
I'm slowly growing into thinking that the medical profession on Star Army of Yamatai starships is a bit overrated given the means we have. I am strongly tempted into making it so that if I do make another plotship after the Miharu that this ship be able to perform the essential medical functions which needs being done with minimal player involvement.
 
Well, we could go for an automated medical bay or perhaps medical robots...the robots would be portable and could carry HS material and various drugs inside.
 
That's somewhat cold. I was more of the mind to push for having pretty much everyone be able to operate the medical equipment itself - seeing any dedicated doctor will have a hard time beating a hemosynth tank in effectiveness. The goal isn't to prevent any medical related RP from happening, but rather not slate a person to having only that role when the jobs needed to be done in that regard seldom happen.
 
Well, that's why the medical occupation was absorbed into the science one. Are you saying we should get rid the Sci/Med green shirts on small starships or altogether?
 
Well, the way I use the green shirts on my ship ends up having them be bridge crew in a way. I mean, I make them researchers and sensor operators. I think we could make do with having crewmen be more polyvalent. Those with preferences will involve themselves more in things.

Heck, I even think the same could be done with the Caretaker job. I mean, I have my XO Yukari and my chief engineer volunterring to do it because they want to.
 
If you want, I could write up a standardized article for nekovalkryja triage treatments of various injuries. I've had enough trial and error in application to know how to go about a treatment of a Neko or Yamataian, also, I'm pretty handy at the medical bits.

Just drop me a message if you'd like me to handle it, a wiki article can be whipped up within a short while.

EDIT:

On the matter of a green-shirt job, it is my general understanding that the capability to treat a nekovalkryja, or any other species with the equipment available on a Yamataian ship would require the need to be able to utilize the MEGAMI and Kessaku OS in a manner which would allow the greenshirt to be able to utilize ship sensors. Along with that matter, greenshirts have been designated as that one job that don't get sent out into the fire... unless they're Nepleslian, know too much, have the hots for the Taisa, and have modified a Type-28 SMG to be a side arm.

But my point is, the Green-Shirt is a needed job, because they are essentially the designated medics, information sources, and valuable asset in medical and science-related emergencies... that is IF the player can pull it off.
 
If you want, I could write up a standardized article for nekovalkryja triage treatments of various injuries. I've had enough trial and error in application to know how to go about a treatment of a Neko or Yamataian, also, I'm pretty handy at the medical bits.
That'd kick ass.
 
Well, that's why the medical occupation was absorbed into the science one. Are you saying we should get rid the Sci/Med green shirts on small starships or altogether?
I am looking at this thread with great interest, how does a medical specialist/officer act on a ship. And this quote caught my interest because in the current setting it is kinda redundant to have medical personnel or green shirts on a ship that actually could be replaced by robotic medical. Now I would add to this discussion in saying, no you should not remove the medical personnel from a ship or any setting. Yet modernizing and taking off some weight from medical personnel with the current technology that is available should be implanted onto the ships. Medical personnel still require to know all of the medical treatments and how to use these robots, but at the same time be lited of the burden to worry about little injuries or get assistance with complex operations. I think I am willing to look into this part and see if robotic infusion to assist the current medical officer in his/her duties is worth exploring.

How does the community look into this approach? Or stick with the old fashion "Doctor I don't feel so good" while soldiers with torn-off limbs come in due to the war.
 
I'm not sure what you're asking here.
Basically, the current setting is aimed and weighted onto medical personnel doing the task. Yet what I am asking and wondering is to combine robotic medical care with the current medical personnel. Is that feasible to make it work?
 
I think it is. The OOC reasoning for making the automated medical treatment centers were that medical characters may or may not be present in the plot, and if they are you want them in the field in the RP action instead of stuck back in the medical bay onboard the ship in orbit.
 
Having a trained medical person greatly increases the level of care that can be dealt with. I imagine that an autodoc is good, but it doesn't always deal with edge cases well. Such as if a crew member has a limb that has bee ln turned into an ailen one against their will or damage to complicated cybernetic interface. If you jave an autodoc, it might just keep you alive while you get to a hospital while a trained medical person can fix you without that.
 
There is also another element that I have just realized in regards of medical treatment that is key for personal trained in it and robotics might miss. Empathy, letting people feel heard after a traumatic experience is part of the job, but does that make a medical officer a counselor ?
 
That is a good question, and I think that ideally the answer would be yes. However, in terms of play, Sacre and TraumaPatcher Care Seven Six 76-6165-3411 were both not very empathic in their own ways. As examples of Medics who aren't good at the counciler/empathy side of it.
 
Player characters as medics, in my experience, are fallible. Having a robot that knows the right thing to do and is not fallible increases the likelihood of that player character making a mistake but now through a robot that shouldn't be making mistakes. I don't know if it helps the situation if they're playing one more character that shouldn't mess things up when it is easy to do so.
 
So that would say there is additional training medical personnel should learn to deal with people that got traumatized experience from whatever they have. Plus creating another job that focus on taking care of specialized medical equipment medical technician.
 
I agree that basic medics do have some basic counselor functions. There's specialists too but you're not going to find them on small starships with small crews.
 
No, I think a medic robot job should just be a role for the GM, RaWolfe.
 
No, I think a medic robot job should just be a role for the GM, RaWolfe.
Yea I do agree with that, but that was not what I meant with Medicial technician. In the current real life society you see that jobs getting fused to meet public demand. Biggest example is that a nurse becomes a technician nurse and basically means that s/he is able to fix equipment without asking for help or is able to handle complicated machinery.

Maybe far fetched from the thread itself, just worth thinking about it.

I do wonder how much a Yamatai doctor would relay on his robotic assistant (so to speak). I mean if due a kuv attack the robotic medbay is down, it’s basically back to the doctor roots of knowledge and experience. Additional I also wonder (yes I wonder about a lot) how medical personnel keeps themselves well trained. Is knowing it out the books better then field experience for yam doctor, I really wonder
 
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