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The Limits of Techology

Cannonball

Cannonball

Inactive Member
This small question has come to me after browsing through the technical data for the military starships and combat power armour for the Yamatai Star Army (as well as the various Neko models).

With the ability to fold space, create blackholes, fire weapons that can turn pockets of reality into "deadzones" and craft artifical lifeforms that can negate gravity (to a degree), turn invisible, and morpth their own bodies and alloy substances that are all but indestructable (not to mention the power sources for all of this) it brings up the small and simple question of where is the limit?

I have read of a couple of item proposals that were shunned somewhat for being technologicaly unfesasble and yet you have all of the above. Don't get me wrong, the system you have here is organized, comprehensive and detailed but I'm the sort of person who likes to know where the walls is only so I can see where I'm going.
 
I am not sure there is a defined limit to technology, we are advancing what we make so often that our technology is advancing as well. I think you should just assume that if you are planning on making something technological just try to make it feasible to what other people have made so far.
 
It has been noticed how horribly over powered the Star Army Of Yamatai's tech level is, and also how unfeasable. Unfortunately due to much of the technology being a staple in the RP, it is not really possible to push aside the tech and claim it does not exist, it would wreck the plotline. Ever since the overpowered tech was noticed as such, new technologies that approach that level of absurdity are often shunned.
 
Cannot the description of many of these techs be revised to make them more feasible, as opposed to there total removal (which, as you said, would violate the continuity of the setting)? Make Zesanium just a very tough alloy as opposed to a nigh unbreachable mythical substance, and so on with the other ultra-overpower items?
 
Yeah, dumbing down something this vital would turn this entire place inside out unfortunatnly. Thanks for the replies Doc and Luke, I'll keep them in mind if I ever feel the need to apply some creative muscle here and there.

P.S it seems I also have the wall I was looking for. What we have now is as good as it gets (in a sense). Thanks again all.
 
I'm sure there's been discussions on this before. Not sure what to tell you to search for though. The ST Debate thread, perhaps?
 
Wasn't that just about mind transfrerrals though?

Anyway, if you want to create something, just look at things that have been approved and talk to people who know what can and can't be done.

My personal reccomendation is Rob, talk to him on Yim if you wanted to do something and he could probably tell you weather its possible or not.
 
Luke, I think I recall there being discussion, or at least remarks in passing, about the tech level. While the main topic was ST technology, I think there was mention of other tech as well. Searching might yield a result if you can use a good word, but I don't know exactly what to tell you about that. I'm not sure if a topic was ever started with the intention of debating the tech level, but it's been discussed before.
 
DocTomoe said:
Ever since the overpowered tech was noticed as such, new technologies that approach that level of absurdity are often shunned.
Click to expand...

On the other hand, we still have new "anti-fleet" weapons using black holes. Now, it may be feasible, but lets be honest, this takes play-balance out behind the woodshed. But then, perhaps thats just me; I always abhored super-weapons in RTS games after all.
 
Ah! Ok then, maybe a topic should be started about feasible tech levels, it would make it a lot easier for people trying to create something as they would know weather it could or could not be done!
 
Firstly, I do not see how reducing the overall efficacy of the technology used in SARP will destroy the system. Wouldn't such a overall decrease maintain the proportions of weapons (i.e. a battleships guns are much more powerful than a destroyers, which are much more powerful than a power armors) and defenses?

Also, you guys need to realize that if you ever want to leave the fantasy tech land this setting currently operates with you are going to have to accept that there will be continuity violations. It's the good with the bad, to regain a semblance of balance and any faint font of realism some sacrifice will need to be made. If you guys are not willing to accept even minor changes in how things go (as a overall tech reduction would do, it would not vastly change how battles are fought, etc.) than just stop trying to make things realistic and accept that the setting will never not be fantasy (as opposed to sci-fi, it is not sci-fi with the current tech). So long as scout have weapons capable of destroying fleets and invincible armors created by "temporal energyâ€
 
I think that the point is that we are reducing tech levels by not making such uber things anymore, this was we stop things getting any more out of hand, then very slowly so as not to disrupt gameplay bring things down to a feasible level.
 
Vesper said:
Unfortunately a theatrical setting (which is how SARP is portrayed) cannot exist in tandem with a ultra-high tech level. The two just don't mesh. So, to keep a good setting the tech level must be reduced. It doesn't even have continuity with your own history as is (as you will have read above).
Click to expand...
It's worked for five years now.
 
Im not saying you can't play it with the contradiction of the tech and the theatrical playstyle. I'm saying that the two aren't going to meld in any sort of realistic fashion.

If you stay with the ultra-high (nigh fantasy) tech and don't care about any sort of realism in relation to it, then you can play it fine. The conflict comes when you try to apply realism and game balance to the tech and setting.
 
Science Fiction is :

  • * the effect of imagined science
    * the imagined effect of actual science
    * imagined technology based upon actual science
    * imagined technology based upon imagined science
    * the effect of science and technology on the present day society
    * the effect of science and technology on an imagined society.
As such, the SARP does redefine the boundaries of realism in it's setting and so theatrical portrayal are possible, albeit not inn the form and function you'd expect from our culture. It merely requires some pushing past the envelope called 'suspension of disbelief'

The Type 29 fleet program calls the Star Army to use less ships for engagements, namely in reason that plotships will be able to be of more influence instead of just being one ant amongst many.

The super-heavy weaponry ships have do have the ability to whipe out opposing forces, but then again, the current fleet organisation stressed quality over quantity now, instead of this being the reverse. The Macross/Robotech anime also proves that you can have the destructive potential the SARP has and be able to show a functional space opera in it.

Furthermore, the latest ships made by the Star Army tend to lean more toward crew amenities, multi-purpose roles, modular parts and more varied-wider firing arcs weaponry over sheer destructive power. The shift is there, being made slowly as the Star Army develop it's fleet to it's needs. While they do have the technology to make better, it doesn't mean what they ship out is essentially better and so there is some toning down being made to manage ressources better.

Why? Because there are world to colonize, worlds to explore, fortifications to be made and all that sort of stuff. The space navy isn't the only thing needing ressources in the Empire. Not to mention that some of the weapon systems installed on ships are wasteful to make AND to use.

Anyhow, my expectations of space skirmishes is to slowly retract from naval/macross like warfare and go more the way of battles seen in Babylon 5, for example... though I'd really like it if it'd turn out like how things are in Crest of the Stars/Banner of the Stars or even Descent Freespace 2 (actually, in terms of scope, FS2 has a lot in common with the SARP).
 
Vesper said:
Firstly, I do not see how reducing the overall efficacy of the technology used in SARP will destroy the system. Wouldn't such a overall decrease maintain the proportions of weapons (i.e. a battleships guns are much more powerful than a destroyers, which are much more powerful than a power armors) and defenses?

Also, you guys need to realize that if you ever want to leave the fantasy tech land this setting currently operates with you are going to have to accept that there will be continuity violations. It's the good with the bad, to regain a semblance of balance and any faint font of realism some sacrifice will need to be made. If you guys are not willing to accept even minor changes in how things go (as a overall tech reduction would do, it would not vastly change how battles are fought, etc.) than just stop trying to make things realistic and accept that the setting will never not be fantasy (as opposed to sci-fi, it is not sci-fi with the current tech). So long as scout have weapons capable of destroying fleets and invincible armors created by "temporal energyâ€
Click to expand...
 
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