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Computer Operation (basic principles)

There is an element that we must consider here as well. That is the fact that PANTHEON and its subordinates have another level of protection: The living one.

From what I understand Kessaku Technicians and Starship Operators are constantly monitoring the systems they work on, providing another set of eyes with "beyond the descision making of computers" ability.

It is also probably safe to say there are some hardcoded safeguards or base level that cannot be edited or changed.
 
In the 5th XF plot I had going when Andrew was on his first leave-of-absence, I had a KAMI-class unit be hacked and go haywire. That plot's long done now, so it's no longer worth keeping the secret of how I imagined to do it.

Basically, SAINT didn't bother with trying to alter the machine's reality or anything. It just altered the machine -- gave the KAMI a new core the organization had brought up itself to act the way it wanted. Trying to justify it now seems silly, but maybe SAINT didn't want to go through the trouble of trying to slowly alter the perception of a KAMI unit five days old?

That kind of helps what Wes says, I think. KAMI units are too smart; just swap machines was the mentality.

And what Andrew said.
 
Miharu's MEGAMI computer system resists outside hacking through the simple stubborn reluctance to communicate with anything other than the lesser elements of its own network - and when she really wants to talk to outsiders, she uses her less powerful CIES sister as the scapegoat and if something goes wrong, she just pulls the plug and hacks the less-powerful CIES back to her side.

Miharu is likely one of the few ships that can actually, in such a fashion, resist administrative seizure of control from the rest of the PANTHEON network (Yui: "Fold to Yamatai." Miharu: "Um... no. I feel lazy today."). The bright side of that is that no enemy can hack her in turn as long as she stays in 'her shell' - which includes the power Eve had over PANTHEON when Yuumi was still in her clutches.
 
Look, I can appreciate the arguments here, but nothing that has been said convinces me that hacking is impossible. I've never disputed that to hack PANTHEON is an incredibly difficult task. I've been agreeing with that from square one. But it is not an imposable one.

So perhaps the method of hacking is more akin to psychological warfare then computer science. It's still hacking, and the same motivations apply. A black hat would find driving a MEGAMI insane as much fun as dropping the power grid for a continent. For that matter, depending on how you approach it, you could get the same results by driving a MEGAMI mad as by a conventional hack. And If you're looking to cause trouble, driving a capitol ship's AI into full on HAL 9000 mode works pretty damn well.

As an aside, the MEGAMI that Fred was talking about is an excellent example of the empty space firewall. It's the only 100% effective countermeasure against hacking, which is to say, not being on the network in the first place.
 
Okay---(Excuse grammar and spelling as that I am at work with no ability to use checkers)

Let me put it this way; Another element to bring into this conversation is the level of desire for the GMs in to participate in that kind of a senario (And no I am not saying I am not open to it)

What I am trying to describe to you is simply this; there would also have to be some good story behind WHY such a senario would occur. In addition to that, the GMs collaborating on the senario would need to be in agreement that it is how they want the story to proceed. (Since in SARP , it is the GM's responsiblilty to handle the RP of the computer system: and for two GMs with meeting plots to discuss the effects on each other's plots).

For me anyway it would require some really good story for me to even glance at such a senario like this. It would need the person on the other end to be a really good roleplayer. And no, in disclaimer it has nothing to do with the desire to be invincible. Being the loser in the senario is sometimes a good thing.

So I guess my questions are:

Why are you asking these questions?
What are your intentions? Some kind of hacker plot?
 
Well, a lot of it has to do with the fact that I am rather stubborn and endlessly curious. It piqued my interest when I saw that consensus holds PANTHEON to be unhackable. That got me wondering just how the system could have been set up to render it so. Thus far, my conclusion has been that while conventional (which is to say, modern) hacking is not viable, a similar effect might be achievable through unconventional means.

I know it's rather arrogant, but the fact that the system has been declared 100% secure is a challenge to my sense of ingenuity.

A hacker plot may be something I'd be willing to try, assuming the cooperation the leadership here. I'm aware that it will only happen with the consent of the GMs, but it's not something I'd like to see ruled out entirely simply because people have become used to seeing a system as unbreakable. I don't propose to try this in the RP just because I think I can, but I want the option there if I or someone with a better understanding of the system comes up with a reason to try.
 
A hacker plot may be something I'd be willing to try, assuming the cooperation the leadership here.
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With all due respect, you are very new to this site. I would like to see you gain some serious experience in the setting before you consider such an endeavor. Plus it will give you some time to get to know us, and for us to get to know you. :)
 
One can dream, yes?

Even if I was a vet, I'm not going to have the time to devote to GMing something until the summer, at the least. For now, I'm just trying to broaden my understanding of the limits of what can be accomplished with the technology available in the most sure fire way possible. Charging straight at them and waiting for the bounce.
 
Godel's incompleteness theorem basically says that No matter how hard you try to make a perfect system you can't get there (it killed the perfection of number theory). This being said, all of the previous arguments still hold. The PANTHEON system is very complex and anyone with enough power/knowledge to hack it is probably in the Yamatai empire and known specifically to the the government or Kessaku. So even if they tried to hack it, they'd be caught in a matter of days and either put to work or put to death.

I agree with Andrew, any story involving hacking PANTHEON would have to be GREAT and extremely well thought out.

(sorry if this is already a dead issue, I just wanted to add this to end the argument)
 
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