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OOC [OOC] - Senate of Yamatai Discussion

OsakanOne said:
My character Sana Nakamura is still a Yamataian citizen and national: What system should my ambassador represent?
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Nobody would elect Sana as a senator, lol.
 
"How to join
As a player, you may claim any unclaimed worlds by posting in the OOC thread and then being granted it by Wes. There is the following criteria for approval; You have to like Yamatai, don't go trying to sabotage it from the inside. You're a elected official, have some sense. You will be expected to be the curator for your chosen world and may be prompted to add content to it. After you are approved, you can bring a relevant character, if any, or create a new NPC. New NPCs must be approved, still, however the process is much more lenient. Once done - Welcome to the Senate! Don't forget to edit the information into this page when you're done."

from the wiki. Reminding for everybody's sake.
 
Yamatai-centric GMs (Fred, me, and Nashoba) voted against the treaty, while the Lorath faction leaders (Luca and DocTomoe) have come in here to vote yes. And now Osaka, also of the Lorath, suddenly wants to grab a senate seat? Please. I can see what's happening. If people join the YSE senate just to sabotage my faction, that's a problem.
 
I think we could do without the trashtalking.

And OoCly, it seems clear to me that after getting worked up (mostly for Doshii's sake) about this treaty is that all this means for the setting is essentially a renaming and renegociation of what DATASS was.

Yes, I'm still onboard with the idea that Yui's excuse was a dumb one, but we all knew (unless you were living under a rock) that Yamatai was going to do something about the DATASS during the past 2 IC years. I also made it clear that Kotori wasn't happy about the loss of face, but pragmatically could see why Yui's play had to be backed by the senate.

And while I don't exactly mind being called worthless, I'm wondering who in his right mind would call Nashoba's level-headed and well justified IC input to the motion as worthless. I think Nashoba's demonstrated that while he is Wes' partner in running this community that he's not a Yes-man. I'm not exactly close to the guy, but I will defend his integrity anyday.
 
I agree that Nash's explanation of the why's was very good. I brought up the motion with Luca primarily because of IC reasoning regarding the Senate looking the fool because of the justifications used, more than any overall intent to sabotage things. Political drama like this will only help move things along and pressure Yui somewhat to respect the spirit of DATASS
in negotiating its successor.
 
This post was written out of stupidity and is only loosely attached to reality. So please ignore it. I'm only leaving it up so as not to create a hole in the flow of the thread.

Again sorry.
@Wes: I'm sort of offended that you're calling me @OsakanOne. Given that I lack their habit of ignoring the rules for long stretches of time and trolling members of the community for amusement. I have tried to be a good player and member of this site, but it seems that it's easier to erase my identity and lump me in with the 'undesirables' without consideration.

The reason I wanted to write in the senate thread wasn't to pressure the vote in any one way but actually to raise the question of what terms Yamatai would want to present to the foreign powers and question why Yamatai had decided to back out of the treaty rather than proposing to modify it to the benefit of all involved. Basically I wanted to work toward strengthening Yamatai's position and work toward figuring out something that wouldn't create an international incident as the Senate should want.

I wanted to participate in the senate for once (since it is hardly ever active) and actually play the part of a Yamataian senator with over a decade of SAoY history, because I thought it would make the situation more interesting than just having it as "yes/no" based on peoples OOC stance by actually taking the time to address circumstances and currents that exist IC.

But I guess if I'm going to be pigeon holed and lumped in with people who have been belligerent and trolled in the past perhaps it is for the best that I don't.
 
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I have no idea what @Eistheid is even talking about. When said Osaka I was definitely talking about Osakanone. Eistheid, to my knowledge, has never posted in this thread before.
 
Fred said:
Eistheid, buddy, you weren't the target of that.
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Sorry. Especially @Wes, I should have read the thread more thoroughly, and I apologize for my stupidity.

I've had a lot of terrible things going on IRL, I also literally just woke up. So I'll admit that I'm not exactly in the best head space right now. Upon reading Wes' post I admittedly went to check the forum for character approvals and when I didn't see a submission from Osaka, I assumed the worst.

Again, I'm sorry. But I'm feeling irritable and it's much too easy to assume the worst right now. I'll try to avoid it in the future.

Edit: @Wes I have a senator sitting in the approval forum as I was hoping to participate in the present senate thread. I had assumed that the normal character approval process applied for senate characters.
 
It's okay, I know I messed up and I accept that. All I can do is move forward.

I would like to point out that this business in the senate could be turned into positive exposure for the Empire rather than being treated as a disgrace. I'm not sure if it could be similarly salvaged in the IRC portion of the thread but I'm pretty sure it could be turned around in both with minimal effort.
 
Can you link to to this senate character you're working on @Eistheid?
 

Of the Lorath? Are we divided into realms and kingdoms now?

Why? You laid out the rules and none of us are in violation of any of them.

If you didn't want people disagreeing with you, why are you holding a vote?

Also, almost all of us got our start with Yamatai and we have a lot of very fond memories.

We left over fundamental disagreements we were willing to discuss and work through but the management at the time wasn't interested. The site has similar disagreements once every few months, still and its the mains source of player bleed-off from Yamatai into other factions to this day nearly a decade later.

I miss the Yamatai that was. The one that got along with its neighbors and had bigger fish to fry than intimidating those who'd rather cooperate because they wanted cooperation, not to kneel and lick Yamatai's imperialist boot. They dealt with threats and mysteries on a much bigger scale and something in me felt that was very noble and I really respected that. If those days were back, do you think there would even be a need for the Lorath to begin with?

Disagreeing with you isn't trying to sabotage with you, its having a slightly different vision. I think the best outcome would be to vote for a third option, for everyone to sit down and hash this out again instead of rendering it in the wind or assuming it was fine to begin with.

I still think Yamatai has tremendous room for incredible storytelling that nobody on the site has even imagined yet and I think the next big frontier is going to be settling in with their neighbors and realizing that international relations are kind of important and that our mutual differences create strength, not weakness.

Overspecialise and you breed in weakness. Its slow death.
 
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Osaka, that never happened. Maybe you never perceived it, but Yamatai has been the way you say you dislike at least since YE 27. YE 28 was the Lorath first-contact. The only period of time you got Yamatai to start "behaving" better was during Himiko's rule, because that Empress is more image-conscious. The peak of that so far was the DATASS treaty.

Right now, a lot of people seem to be thinking that losing the DATASS treaty is the end of the world. It's not. It just needs to be renegociated, with a few conditions being more favorable to Yamatai. It's not like there aren't any real world analogs to Yamatai - the United States don't really ask the United Nations thier permission when going to war (though the UN have expressed unhappiness about that from time to time). But the United States are at peace with the United Nations.
 

Yamatai dealt with things on a basis of firefights rather than conquests. They had conflicts, not wars. They got into scraps instead of threatening to wipe out a civilization. That is the era I'm describing. I'm looking at the outcome rather than the narrow events that led to the outcome. During that time, Yamatai got things done. Not all of it was agreeable, sure but they very rarely went too far out of line until they royally and I mean royally fucked up with unprovoked attacks on civilians and their response to asymmetrical warfare of involving populations in attempted deterrents.

The only reason you wouldn't want permission is if you had higher goals because going to war is always costly. Nothing at this point can do serious harm to Yamatai, so its laughable to even suggest this is an issue of national security.

The desire to forgo negotiations (during which Yamatai should be 100% free to conduct intelligence and assessment of the implied threat to best deal with it should it be ruled an actual threat) in fact, suggests Yamatai profits from these excursions.
 
I'm with Fred here. You must be mis-remembering. Even in Yamatai's earliest days the YSE was an aggressive conqueror, taking over Albini by force, and it was willing to glass Ralfaris and most of the Qel'noran species for rebelling against the Empire. The only thing that made Yamatai mellow out was the UOC split (which was largely caused by the Freespacer genocide). Since then, Yamatai has been pretty subdued and has been less about takeovers and more about getting along with its neighbors. But that doesn't mean it gave up its warrior streak.

The biggest reason to reject DATASS is simply because we don't need it. What did it offer us? Military assistance in wartime? Which is essentially meaningless. The Star Army is capable of defending Yamatai without assistance, and has consistently shown zero interest in working with other military forces because there's no reason to do so. In the plainest terms, the real purpose of DATASS was always to put a leash and collar on the Star Army of Yamatai for the peace of mind of Nepleslia and Lor. It was never designed to really benefit Yamatai in the first place, and that's why Yamatai had to be bullied into accepting it two years ago. And being bullied into it was exactly why we left ourselves a loophole out of it.
 
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