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Tier system expansion

Alex Hart

Alex Hart

Well-Known Member
This thread is about exactly what it sounds like. I'd like to expand the tier system slightly to better reflect the sizes of things, and give us a better way to represent very large objects such as stations. My proposal is to add 3 new tiers to the tier setup, for space stations and star fortresses. These would be tiers 16-18, and would be light, medium and heavy star fortress tiers. This would allow us to better manage ships that are currently simply so large that they just don't seem to work in the current tier system, such as the Izanagi Dreadnought.
 
I want to anticipate someone coming in here about power metagaming. And say before hand i dont think thats an issue here.

The Izanagi is an inpheaseable ship 14 times larger than nepleslia's Primus battelship and like 10 times larger than the HorrorShow back when we had it. There will never be another ship like it and i think any generation of the NTSE would agree.

What this proposes would be for massive star installations like star-fortresses and citadels and the like. The only two factions that can even really field ships as large as some of these battleships are Nepleslia and Yamatai, And i think it would be a good idea to have a kind of IC battleship treaty correspondence or agreement where they agree not to build anything above a certain size or armament class to ensure nobody just tries to build another SUPER MEGA DREADNOUGHT and cant even atempt it without the two powerhouses of the setting sanctioning or imposing their power on them to avoid this. And that dreds and the like sit comfortably within T-15 Heavy Capital ship, While having room for new possibilities without factions attempting power creep with superweapon ships 14+ miles long that non advanced factions cant field and sit and complain about yamatai or nepleslia and unfairness.
 
Right now there really isn't a reason to increase the tiers. Even if you consider stations, one, those are at that point 'buildings' and we don't give tiers to buildings or planets, it's more upto the GM to decide when they go. But also the big thing, there are no weapons on that scale that aren't narrative weapons. If we made such weapons that would mean making non narrative weapons that can wipe out flag ships in a single shot. That is a horrible idea for the site. Something of that power should stick to being narrative, and if it's narrative there are no need for numbers. I understand there are some super huge ships, but it's better for the site to find ways to make them work with the current numbers than including a new bracket (like make the 'front' 'middle' and 'back' of a super huge ship count as separate ships structurally)
 
A treaty to stop super sized ships ICly would be nice personally. It's just a matter of coming up with an IC reason for it.
 
Well as stated in my post, I don't think it's a good idea. Things in that size should stay on the 'narrative' scale. If we open up tiers to that, it also opens up weapons to that level. And every faction is going to try and build a ship of that size because it could wipe out anything.
 
The thing about making ships that large work with the current numbers means that they'll have the same amount of weaponry as a ship much much smaller, which kind of doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
 
Im still for it, If it can be set in such a way it cannot be abused. From an NTSE perspective i give way to Syaos insight on things as my seinor and someone better inclined in such matters.

Syaoran said:
A treaty to stop super sized ships ICly would be nice personally. It's just a matter of coming up with an IC reason for it.
Click to expand...



Border friction and to help with the on again off again cold war style arms race between nepleslia and yamatai. That Nepleslia can take heart that yamatai wouldnt produce anymore super ships that can threaten an entire assault fleet by itself, And that yamatai can take heart that nepleslia wont try to build their own izanagi that would just kick off another arms race and tensions of their own.

It would also be an IC reason for non advanced factions to not build super-ships and dreadnoughts that can threaten an advanced factions battleships after looking at the example of arguably the only dred still on site and using that (the izanagi) as an example to start their work. And it stops smaller factions who just want to power creep but get away with it cause they are small not build say; a dreadnought 5 miles long that can outgun a nepleslian battleship that should give a less advanced faction a run for its money because of having more IC better tech and weapons but the other factions ship is more recent in setting so is somehow better cause they have newer weapons etc.

Pretty much its a good IC tool to stop power creep between large or even small factions. I know its not allowed to argue in a submission about other articles as to why they should be allowed, But people clearly base their newest X off the competition. And the izanagi is kind of the example rn for dreadnoughts until nepleslia rolls out one.
 
Well first we should be -avoiding- making those massive ships in the first place, as I said, such things should honestly be left to narrative things, which don't get proper stats in teh first place.
 
Alex Hart said:
This thread is about exactly what it sounds like. I'd like to expand the tier system slightly to better reflect the sizes of things, and give us a better way to represent very large objects such as stations. My proposal is to add 3 new tiers to the tier setup, for space stations and star fortresses. These would be tiers 16-18, and would be light, medium and heavy star fortress tiers. This would allow us to better manage ships that are currently simply so large that they just don't seem to work in the current tier system, such as the Izanagi Dreadnought.
Click to expand...
I was going to agree with you at first, but tier 15's examples are already the Izanagi and Zodiac star forts. Nothing except massive constructs should get approved at tier 15 as it is.
 
Yhea, adding stuff at the top end seems like a bad idea. Making it more granular would take a whole new dr system.
 
Honestly, there's a bunch of Nep stuff that I haven't touched yet that needs downtiering.

https://wiki.stararmy.com/doku.php?id=faction:nepleslia:weapons:heavy_penetrating_assault_rifle Like the HPAR, which is a Power armor rifle that does Tier 7 or Tier 8 Damage without using aether or antimatter. It's completely out of line with everything else Nepleslia has, and i'm pretty sure that the HPAR isn't supposed to be an anti-mecha weapon.

Edit: This is me saying so as a Submission reviewer, not as a Nepleslian GM.
 
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