Yamatai Census of YE 46

Soban said:

Ye 30 to the present is like 16 years in character?

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Yeah. And if no one roleplayed anything happening to those empty systems then they're not colonized. That's how a living universe works.

That's like the complete opposite of a living universe, but whatever. So what systems that we haven't established a population for do you think should have zero population?

Soban said:

That's like the complete opposite of a living universe, but whatever.

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No. That's how a living universe is supposed to work: You've got to at least plant the seeds of something occurring in order for it to be added, on SARP that's through roleplay. Saying "well ackshually they colonized it in YE 41" is simply a retcon. As an example, that's why there's a policy that new setting elements such as corporations should originate in the current year if prior RP doesn't exist.

@raz , Wes has already clearly mentioned his support and intentions for this project. He has also politely asked you to cease trying to derail the effort and actually contribute if you feel so strongly about it. Cease this behavior.

I've already discussed my position with Wes and am permitted to share my thoughts on the subject, demibear. He only asked that discussion be limited to ideas rather than whether people are qualified to make changes.

Awesome, so what systems that we haven't established a population for do you think should have zero population?

Step up, good opportunity right here.

Soban said:

Awesome, so what systems that we haven't established a population for do you think should have zero population?

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Any system that:

• does not have previous mention of settlement or population on the wiki
• does not have any roleplay that suggests it has ever had permanent settlements or a significant population

should not be given any population without new colonization roleplay.

Additionally, any system that only has a token population mentioned for mining or resource gathering probably shouldn't have a population beyond a few hundred thousand (more realistically tens of thousands). Nor should any system's population grow drastically without roleplay to support it; population booms don't happen without having made the IC news over the years. Wes asked for population trends to justify changes and those cannot happen without roleplay.

Some population increases are a good starting point to giving new life and love to some of the existing out of date articles to update them to current times as well.

A page mostly untouched for over a decade (which is a lot of time!) with nothing occurring in them beyond wiki updates to strict and a plot ship passing through five years ago getting some population is a good start and even excuse to give some of our currently barren skub systems some updates in modern lore and other updates to make them more interesting and worth visiting in rp and not just a dot with a flag on the map if anyone feels like taking on such projects. They can be fun and it’s like replacing wilted flowers in your home with fresh ones to brighten up the place with new ideas and interesting locations~

I think step 1a might be going through history, seeing which systems got hit hard during war, identifying where, if anywhere refugees went and estimating how many there were, and then applying those reductions and increases at the right time in history if they haven't been. Whether that is 1MW, 2MW, KW, or 3MW.
It's important to not mess with stuff there was no RP on like Raz is saying, but it's very, very important to make sure you don't miss any RP that did happen.

What happened with Ushobrakflug should be strictly avoided in the future. That was a straight retcon adding decades of history to somewhere that no RP happened, which is exactly what shouldn’t be happening through this project.

Do things right by the setting and how it’s been legitimately built up or don’t do them at all.

raz said:

What happened with Ushobrakflug should be strictly avoided in the future. That was a straight retcon adding decades of history to somewhere that no RP happened, which is exactly what shouldn’t be happening through this project.

Do things right by the setting and how it’s been legitimately built up or don’t do them at all.

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I gave new life and potential to a place nobody had touched in a period longer than it takes most people to reach halfway to adulthood. Not you or one single other person did anything with it and had your chance that entire time as it sat there abandoned and unloved. And nobody found any actual fault with what I did, in fact I received a lot of support across the board for my update with the only detractors being you and Ame whose only arguments were that I don't belong here, I'm a loser, and all my submissions are shit.

Doing right by the setting is to continue to improve it and fix it, including the old. You fix your broken house and make it nice again so the neighborhood kids will come and play again instead of standing on your rickety old porch and trying to chase them away. SARP is a sandbox several decades in the making. People have come and gone and built their nice sand castles over that entire time and they were very nice.

But the wood of the box has gotten old, the sand a bit dirty, and the castles are just piles of sand now. But god forbid anyone tries to come in and fix any of that up or make another castle someone will come running and waving their arms frantically and pointing at the mounds frothing about how you cant touch their sand it's so very important that the broken castles stay that way and the wood of the box continues to crack and that the sand never be cleaned because it's forever 2005 when they played and only they can have their nostalgia and play in the sand and any attempt to do so outside of the corners they permit will get them upset.

Tell your stories Raz, you're good at that! Nobody argues that you don't RP and consistently. But it's been over twenty fucking years. It's time to stop slamming the gate on other people trying to do things for this setting like trying to fix the wiki, improve the old, or contribute to the new.

Because as this thread has proven with your every post; Instead of offering solutions, advice, help, or even a friendly word, you're always there to spit and whine and bully people and sliding in at every topic and discussion to offer nothing but insults and accusations because you know Wes wont go further than warning you. You could have been working on fixing up all the little problems you keep getting mad at people for wanting to do something about but instead, you just stomp your foot and insult them as you've been doing this entire thread. You have no ability, right, or authority to dictate what anyone can do in this setting but by your logic you seem to think you do by the amount of times you say you wont allow or permit something lately.

There's nobody left here, Raz. Half the plots are empty or inactive. We don't get new people anymore. We don't have a line of people creating for this setting anymore with mountains of new technologies and things for the players because there is nobody left. And you may be fine with that so long as at the end of the day it is You and Ame and Wes but some of us care about what happens outside of that.

Charmaylarg Dufrain said:

Because as this thread has proven with your every post; Instead of offering solutions, advice, help, or even a friendly word, you're always there to spit and whine and bully people and sliding in at every topic and discussion to offer nothing but insults and accusations because you know Wes wont go further than warning you.

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Haven't insulted nor bullied anyone, and won't stand for your false narratives. Please stop trying to create drama with me simply because you don't like what I have to say. You're making Yamatai an unfriendly faction to roleplay for the people who've been here the longest and contributed the most to it.

My thoughts are completely valid on this topic, and my advice has been consistent: do it right.

People are supposed to make new setting elements and events occur the way we've always done it, by the event starting in the current IC year. No backfilling retcons, which would in this case be sprouting up populations out of nowhere. Those morph the setting in ways that create paradoxical logic in-character.

I think we are missing and opportunity to use the "Territories of Yamatai" page being wildly inaccurate, out of date, and incomplete, as a story point!!

Rather then worrying about it's Impact as a Retcon and instead use it as a jump off point for perhaps a plot? or the like?

Like perhaps "In world" someone has noticed the discrepancy almost like someone is bumping the numbers and mucking with Yamatai's numbers? then we can file this Retconning into a "in universe issue" and don't have to worry about it canon wise other then a leaping off point for a plot perhaps?

I don't want to have this thread spin off, but there are plenty of new people all the time. I've met tons of new players this year and had the awesome opportunity to RP with a few of them. The site's not dying and I really won't stand for that narrative. It's fine.

People like Zack or Osaka that made mountains of tech were shown that SARP can't really handle that. So they left, and as much as I hated to see them go, it makes sense that they did because SARP actually can't handle mountains of tech. It can handle mountains of RP and IC work, so even I've pivoted to doing mostly that.

I think the idea of fixing the old also includes respecting what it used to be and including that in the new build. You don't take a dilapidated victorian and build a new brutalist on top of it. That's all raz is trying to do, from what I've seen, and Soban's working with him well on that front. We don't need to make it into something more than advice being given and taken.

If we want to blow this up in a huge fight, fine. But can we like not here in this thread?