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Approved Submission [Nesh] Tokir've + Mekir've Variable Plasma Sidearms + Ammunition

SirSkully

SirSkully

Well-Known Member
Submission URL
https://stararmy.com/wiki/doku.php?id=corp:galactic_horizon:gh-w4-1a_tokir_ve_variable_plasma_sidearm
List Any Unapproved Sub-Articles
Second gun WIP URL: https://stararmy.com/wiki/doku.php?...zon:gh-w4-1b_mekir_ve_variable_plasma_sidearm
Second gun URL: https://stararmy.com/wiki/doku.php?...zon:gh-w4-1b_mekir_ve_variable_plasma_sidearm

Ammunition WIP URL: https://stararmy.com/wiki/doku.php?...orizon:jargon_multiuse_standard_gas_cartridge
Ammunition URL: https://stararmy.com/wiki/doku.php?...orizon:jargon_multiuse_standard_gas_cartridge
Submission Faction(s)
  1. Neshaten
Submission Terms
  1. I agree
Before anyone says anything yes, this is two weapons in one submission, though they are rather similar in a lot of aspects and one can just do more than the other so I figured it would be alright - kind of the whole Civilian vs Military NSP thing except I made two pages instead of just one with a subsection for variations, anywho here, a military and a civilian plasma pistol.
 
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This is a literal ripoff of the SiZi 38, right down to its ammunition type.
 
>.>

It's a pistol that turns gas into different types of plasma, I would hardly call that a ripoff so calm your farm - by your logic half the guns on the site are ripoffs.
 
I see some reasoning behind Raz's twisted logic, I did approach him a while back to ask if I could use his plasma revolver's ammunition for a semi-automatic pistol that my character Wyatt Alder would create, I was a little disappointed that he made it clear this wouldn't happen but I took that as his final answer.

Then I finished watching Psycho Pass on netflix during a little depressive episode I had, the show has a weapon called the "Dominator" which in its simplest form is a pistol that fires various degrees of energy blasts - from as little as something able to stun a person to something that could melt a robot - and Neshyland has always been a bit sparse with articles so I figured why not adopt something similar that could fill a few roles and make life in Neshyland easier?

Edit: this scene was another inspiration for it.

So I made this, and with context of my previous inquiries to him I could see why Raz might believe I was trying to rip off the weapon he holds so dear but I was not and I can't express that further.

Anyway yeah, this is not a ripoff, they share a few traits in some of the broadest strokes (see ammunition, where this uses a magazine-style reservoir of gas compared to individual multi-shot cartridges) but I honestly don't see this as a ripoff, obviously I would say that as the creator of the article but things already existing in-setting is a reason I have given for not making things before.

That's all I would like to say on the "he stole muh workz" matter, clarification and context - I do not wish for this to be turned into an argument.
 
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SirSkully said:
That's all I would like to say on the "he stole muh workz" matter, clarification and context
Click to expand...
On 4/27/2019, you said in #setting-design:
I plan on making a semi-auto pistol chambered in the m38's plasma rounds, figured I might as well ask if I have permission to do so, Raz
Click to expand...
My reply amounted to a "no." This can be searched for by anybody in the Star Army discord. You proceeded to discord message me further questions. My reply was:
The gunsmith who created the gun owns its schematics and SpacePatent™ and, as their player, I'm not interested in having more of it out there.
Click to expand...
Bolded for emphasis.

Now, 5 months later, you're submitting a "semi-auto pistol" that's powered by variable-power plasma cartridge technology. While you aren't using the SiZi Condensed Plasma Cartridge, you've just made your own version of the gimmick that is my gunsmith's technological, in-character signature and effectively ended up with the same thing as you intended to make based off my character's ammunition in the first place. That's the "clarification and context," and it should be pretty clear why I feel you "stole muh workz." I agree that this shouldn't be turned into an argument, and can admit that it might not even matter that it's a rip-off as far as approvals go. But it is what it is and I think it's notable enough to go on the record.
 
The fact I have to be called for this is kinda sad. The number of similar weapons on the site is large, especially when separate factions are concerned. @raz you didn't let him use your cartridges for a separate gun, so if he wanted that effect the only option for him to use it in a gun this faction can get their hands on really, was to make something similar but distinct in that faction. So calling this a 'rip off' is entirely petty and childish. Because it is your own actions fault that Skully felt that he needed to make it.

And for future reference. I would much rather not like to see post like this in the future where someone post just to say "It's a rip off" rather than stating anything constructive or substantial. It is the NTSE's job to judge whether or not something has become too redundant, not for players to decide, cause there is only so many different theoretical energy weapon technologies that can be employed before we're just making stuff up.
 
I still just want to say that this wasn't an attempt (at least not a conscious one) to make something that could do what the plasma cartridges could lol, but thank you for your input, Syao <3
 
Syaoran said:
I would much rather not like to see post like this in the future where someone post just to say "It's a rip off" rather than stating anything constructive or substantial.
Click to expand...
That's all there is to say about it. If the fact that this submission is a rip-off of my character's in-universe signature is irrelevant then so be it. It was something that had to be noted, though.
 
I guess now us meager players are not only unqualified but now disallowed to even raise concerns because...
Syaoran said:
It is the NTSE's job to judge whether or not something has become too redundant, not for players to decide...
Click to expand...
You’re a fine Staff member @Syaoran but please be cautious of implications. It’s a big deal in my line of work and can cause many problems. The implication here is that players are barred from publicly raising their concerns.

It would be better to note the similarities, emphasize the dissimilarities, and reiterate that it is not against the rules to make similar concepts, no matter how striking the similarities are.
 
If you read it in context, sayo was saying not to raise concerns in that manner. Nothing bars players from raising concern.
 
I see your point and you are correct, Club, and that is part of the point I’d like to make. You’ll notice this a lot in life, most people will get tunnel vision on what they want interests them the most. That is why my caution is specifically on that particular statement. There is nothing inherently wrong with what he’s saying, but the implication is that that specific complaint is off-limits and if that is a person’s only complaint you’ve effectively barred them from expressing their concerns.
Molehill->Mountain

No one should be barred from raising concerns to the NTSE, and this is the most relevant place to do so. Maybe Raz could have worded it better. It is absolutely necessary for the accuser to present his evidence for the accusation to be anything more than anecdotal and be fairly assessed. The NTSE is not a perfect system. It is an imperfect process run by imperfect people. Things will be overlooked, mistakes will occur. If any member sees a problem and doesn’t inform the NTSE and creator it might get missed. It is better to not discourage peers from raising concerns at all, but perhaps encouraging member to raise concerns more appropriately and with better etiquette would be a better solution.
After all, the goal is to encourage forum activity, not reduce it.
 
ok, copy paste all that and stick it in a different thread, now its just derailing the point of this one which is a submission

there is a time and place for raising concerns and here is not the place for this one
 
Don’t be asinine. You were the one that commented on a post intended for Syaoran. That means you furthered that particular discussion. If you do not wish to have more posts on a particular topic in a particular thread that are relevant to a particular comment in said thread just simply don’t comment on that post, and certainly don’t be rude when your point leads to further discussion on said topic.
This could easily have been 1 post in a thread. Now it is 3.
Molehill->Mountain

EDIT: please note, that I never called him asinine, meaning stupid or foolish, but rather was advising that he not be. Naturally the implication was that his previous post was foolish. And that, good sirs and ladies, is the power of implication and the reason I have advised Syaoran to be aware of it.
 
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NOW LISTEN HERE AND LISTEN WELL, FRIENDS IN CONFLICT.

The NTSE submission review rules state :

"Non-staffers can also post questions and help with reviews, or raise concerns. If you choose to participate in a submission review thread, you are expected to follow the same rules as the staff in terms of being helpful "

Other star army forum members have the right to raise concerns or offer assistance and give their general two cents. But it is NOT acceptable to harass, insult, or be generally unproductive. Continuing this logic and any further toxic behavior could result in the thread being locked for a set amount of time (This is skullys article guys. Have some sympathy and let him work on it before you ruin it for him), Action being taken against those seen as being unproductive or toxic, or needing to be removed from this topic.


Ame has already put their backing behind Syao, And they in turn has already made their claim on the situation and as final and junior most third of the NTSE i stand by them as well and recommend youread what syao has said, and czech yourselves before you wreck yourselves and end up sitting in the corner when staff ends up getting involved.
 
I'm going to say this, for the sake of everyone already being in the thread. But then this side discussion will be moved to another thread if it continues. And I will also be brief.

Players have the right to have complaints, but they have the obligation of being -constructive- if they are posting in the NTSE. And players are not given the privilege to -decide- whether or not something benefits the site. So technically, coming in and saying "This is a rip off" and nothing else is a violation of NTSE rules. So yes I am saying that people need to not do that at all in the future, and they do not have a 'right' to do that even if they are sometimes allowed to. If they have more to say then go ahead just follow the rules of conduct.


Now as for the article....I wish there was an @NTSE command XD but anyway, is there anyone who was thinking of taking up this article? Since it sounds like some others had their eye on it before.
 
Guess I'll take this then. Right now only looking at the Tokir've at the moment. But There are a few things,
  • first the first half of the article is massive run on sentences. Like each paragraph is only 1 sentence, this makes it difficult to read and looks unprofessional.
  • Next, under the chart for the 'cost' of each shot, you need to format that without using forced line breaks.
  • The recoil is a bit too light, firing out of your class requires 'compensation'. The standard is that if you're firing out of class (personnel class shooting T4 or higher) is generally that they have to brace the weapon to fire it reliably, as a minimum. 'Heavy' recoil is too light to fire out of class (cause a shotgun is heavy recoil) And of course 'dangerously heavy' is going to need more of a trade off too, otherwise we have unarmored, unboosted infantry that are taking on power armors
  • While 'safety mechanism' is technically the right space for it, the size of the description of how the safety works, it would be better to separate it so that it's more presentable.
  • 'TL;DR's should also not be in the main body of an article
 
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