Soban
Convention Veteran
- Submission Faction(s)
- Yamatai (except Elysia)
- Submission Terms
- I agree
I've updated it so that it has a green smiley face. Used in RP here Yamatai News (YINN) - Seventh Fleet Gathers in Essia
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Approved Submission Tollgate
- Thread starter Soban
- Start date
I've updated it so that it has a green smiley face. Used in RP here Yamatai News (YINN) - Seventh Fleet Gathers in Essia
Andrew
SARPiverse Culture Dreamer
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FM of Tsenlan
🌸 FM of Yamatai
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Just a few things here, I think like any structure this needs some definition like:
Maybe a Systems Section that has information like:
Maybe a Systems Section that has information like:
- What materials are the ring's hull composed of? DR Tier for the structures?
- What is the power source of the rings? Aether?
- Do they have any defenses?
Andrew
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A few things here Soban -
I really think this needs to be fleshed out more and have a more organized structure to the article. Also more wikification of keywords like the date in the history etc. Something like a modified starship template. This would make it more consistent with other submissions on the wiki -
I really think this needs to be fleshed out more and have a more organized structure to the article. Also more wikification of keywords like the date in the history etc. Something like a modified starship template. This would make it more consistent with other submissions on the wiki -
- I also wonder if we need these for short-distance travel. I could see these being used to connect distant places, but do we really need the 3-hour trip from Yamatai to Nepleslia to be any shorter?
- One of the reasons we have speed limits is to prevent "instant" travel, I think this kind of defeats that purpose.
- The 26-hour trip from Jiyuu to the Sharie System in the Kosuke Sector provides good character-building time for GMs.
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Andrew
SARPiverse Culture Dreamer
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FM of Tsenlan
🌸 FM of Yamatai
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- 10LY/Second is way too fast, it completely breaks the speed limitations.
- See Starship Speed Standard on Star Army Space Roleplay and Revised Starship Speed Standard on Star Army Space Roleplay
- Duskerian Wormhole drives are capable of .2 ly/m for example, according to the revised speed standard.
Also, I repeat again:
I have trouble seeing how these are good for the setting. They bypass speed standards, making most travel almost instantaneous ( 10 seconds = 100LY distance by the speed you've listed). If @Wes is willing to grant you an exception, then fine. If not I don't see this article as passable.
Soban
Convention Veteran
This is not a drive, it is a stationary endpoint for a wormhole. Gate wormholes aren't listed on the speed standard, it's listed on Wormholes on Star Army Space Roleplay which I link to in the article.
You are free to think that's too fast, but it's what is already established on the wiki. If we want to change it is a different discussion.
I feel like it is fine as is and a vague 'I want it to be longer' isn't helpful. I feel like it provides more than enough information to be useful In RP. This seems to be a matter of taste and our tastes are different.
You are free to think that's too fast, but it's what is already established on the wiki. If we want to change it is a different discussion.
I feel like it is fine as is and a vague 'I want it to be longer' isn't helpful. I feel like it provides more than enough information to be useful In RP. This seems to be a matter of taste and our tastes are different.
That's why we have a review process. You felt it was complete so you submitted it. However, it's not a valid argument when you are told by the people responsible for deciding whether or not that is the case. Just because you couched it in "i appreciate the feedback" and "you are free to think that way" doesn't make it not passive aggression, which is rude.
Like Andrew, I have a hard time seeing what makes this good for the setting.
As far as Yamatai goes, I don't see them using it, so FM Denied.
Soban
Convention Veteran
As I mentioned, Gate Wormholes are already part of the setting. I specifically referenced several other gate wormholes and the established on the wiki speed standards for them. The Yamatai Governments might not use them (Which is questionable at best given that I run seventh fleet and the RP example is a lead in to them using the gates), but that's not the same as no one from/in Yamatai using them.
I'm not the one who set the speed standards for gate wormholes. If they should be that fast or not is irrelevant to this submission. This is merely a specific application of already existing technology.
Furthermore, this article is perfectly fine under the relaxed standards which is what I was trying to get it approved under anyway.
Therefore, I'm appealing this to @Wes
I'm not the one who set the speed standards for gate wormholes. If they should be that fast or not is irrelevant to this submission. This is merely a specific application of already existing technology.
Furthermore, this article is perfectly fine under the relaxed standards which is what I was trying to get it approved under anyway.
Therefore, I'm appealing this to @Wes
One, this is not an sufficiently or acceptably detailed article for such a major setting element regardless of what you think it is complete as it is. That is our call to make not yours. You thinking it is fine is not a valid point. We're the ones who decide that. If that's all the effort you want to put in, you can bring it up for someone besides the flagship faction. Furthermore, don't assume we don't talk to Wes about this stuff. We don't act unilaterally in a vacuum.
As a related side note, running a fleet isn't to get your NTSE submissions rammed through. You haven't posted anything else from Seventh Fleet in months and months. You are currently derelict in your OOC Management duties, yet you want to use your position as managing a fleet to get a personal project through? Recall that I relinquished Second Fleet when I couldn't keep up with the responsibilities and duties.
And then let's talk about IC reasons. One, you are competing with PAINT, which is a very influential and important organization with a lot of pull and its own interests. Two, Yamatai is a security conscious nation currently embroiled in an existential war, and you are trying to introduce risk factors. There are more, but there's enough here to not need to go into.
This is a highly disruptive submission to the established dynamics of the sector. You aren't submitting this for your own use. Other people will use something that gets approved. It will change a lot of stuff that's sort of fundamental. That needs more work than this. Not taking advantage of easy mode. You tried to get this in before it, and then resubmitted it thinking easy mode would change the prior objections. This is too big for easy mode. If this was a singular, one-off thing to get travel into your GM sector, like we want people to have, we wouldn't have these objections. It would have been good enough. It would have gone through.
Finally, you need to address the passive aggressive rudeness you displayed when the reviewer told you something you didn't like.
As a related side note, running a fleet isn't to get your NTSE submissions rammed through. You haven't posted anything else from Seventh Fleet in months and months. You are currently derelict in your OOC Management duties, yet you want to use your position as managing a fleet to get a personal project through? Recall that I relinquished Second Fleet when I couldn't keep up with the responsibilities and duties.
And then let's talk about IC reasons. One, you are competing with PAINT, which is a very influential and important organization with a lot of pull and its own interests. Two, Yamatai is a security conscious nation currently embroiled in an existential war, and you are trying to introduce risk factors. There are more, but there's enough here to not need to go into.
This is a highly disruptive submission to the established dynamics of the sector. You aren't submitting this for your own use. Other people will use something that gets approved. It will change a lot of stuff that's sort of fundamental. That needs more work than this. Not taking advantage of easy mode. You tried to get this in before it, and then resubmitted it thinking easy mode would change the prior objections. This is too big for easy mode. If this was a singular, one-off thing to get travel into your GM sector, like we want people to have, we wouldn't have these objections. It would have been good enough. It would have gone through.
Finally, you need to address the passive aggressive rudeness you displayed when the reviewer told you something you didn't like.
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Soban
Convention Veteran
First, this is not a major setting element or change. This is putting a new coat of paint on something that already exists. Given that's all I'm doing, getting this approved shouldn't feel like pulling teeth.
Second, this is an Easy Mode submission. The required length for it is 3 sentences, which this easily passes. I've made RP for it, which I've linked. It has the green smiley face. So it meets those requirements. There isn't anything in Easy Mode about which faction it's from.
Third, I posted something for Seventh literally this week. In fact it's the RP I'm using to get this approved. Fletcher also attended the Taisho meeting. So that I'm not doing anything with Seventh is just false. I brought it up because it's an example of someone from Yamatai who would/has used this technology.
Fourth, PAINT is effectively an Airline or a bus company. Infinity Gate isn't competing with them as a transportation provider. They provide the gates, not the ships. They are comparable perhaps to a private company that builds toll roads (Hence Tollgate). Even if they were competing with PAINT, I'm not convinced that would be a bad thing because we can get some good RP out of it.
Fifth, I don't believe that they are significant enough of a risk factor, unless you want to ban all starships because they are too mobile. They can be shut down from either end, they aren't like invulnerable or anything. Essia already has at least one Gate Wormhole before this and there is a Star Fortress there to ensure security. However, this is a matter of opinion and a fertile field for IC discussions. I'm quite happy to have those discussions IC and get some good RP out of it.
Generally, when it comes to IC issues with a submission, I think that's an indicator that we can have good RP about a topic and arguably the item should be approved for that reason. Just OOCly saying 'this would have some resistance ICly' and then not doing the RP is lazy and does a disservice to the submission and the submitter.
Sixth, I'd rather not address your ad hominin attack, but fine. I didn't need Andrews approval on those items. I genuinely do appreciate his feedback even if I don't implement it. Part of the reason for NTSE is exactly for people to comment and work on improving submissions. I don't think Andrew is being mean or anything with his suggestions. However, they are suggestions given that all I'm wanting is an Easy Mode approval. I suppose I could have said "No" but I like to try and get along with people. I'm not someone who likes conflict and being direct like that feels very conflict-y. In fact, the reason I resubmitted this is because I expected very little comment on an article that was frankly a new coat of paint on existing tech and met the Easy Mode guidelines.
Second, this is an Easy Mode submission. The required length for it is 3 sentences, which this easily passes. I've made RP for it, which I've linked. It has the green smiley face. So it meets those requirements. There isn't anything in Easy Mode about which faction it's from.
Third, I posted something for Seventh literally this week. In fact it's the RP I'm using to get this approved. Fletcher also attended the Taisho meeting. So that I'm not doing anything with Seventh is just false. I brought it up because it's an example of someone from Yamatai who would/has used this technology.
Fourth, PAINT is effectively an Airline or a bus company. Infinity Gate isn't competing with them as a transportation provider. They provide the gates, not the ships. They are comparable perhaps to a private company that builds toll roads (Hence Tollgate). Even if they were competing with PAINT, I'm not convinced that would be a bad thing because we can get some good RP out of it.
Fifth, I don't believe that they are significant enough of a risk factor, unless you want to ban all starships because they are too mobile. They can be shut down from either end, they aren't like invulnerable or anything. Essia already has at least one Gate Wormhole before this and there is a Star Fortress there to ensure security. However, this is a matter of opinion and a fertile field for IC discussions. I'm quite happy to have those discussions IC and get some good RP out of it.
Generally, when it comes to IC issues with a submission, I think that's an indicator that we can have good RP about a topic and arguably the item should be approved for that reason. Just OOCly saying 'this would have some resistance ICly' and then not doing the RP is lazy and does a disservice to the submission and the submitter.
Sixth, I'd rather not address your ad hominin attack, but fine. I didn't need Andrews approval on those items. I genuinely do appreciate his feedback even if I don't implement it. Part of the reason for NTSE is exactly for people to comment and work on improving submissions. I don't think Andrew is being mean or anything with his suggestions. However, they are suggestions given that all I'm wanting is an Easy Mode approval. I suppose I could have said "No" but I like to try and get along with people. I'm not someone who likes conflict and being direct like that feels very conflict-y. In fact, the reason I resubmitted this is because I expected very little comment on an article that was frankly a new coat of paint on existing tech and met the Easy Mode guidelines.
Please give me time to get home and help arbitrate this. I'm sure we can get this idea adjusted into something everyone can live with.
No matter what let's keep our tones respectful and avoid getting personal. Talking about anything other than the merits of the submission (e.g. about the poster or reviewer, or tech that has its own approval thread) is unhelpful. Temporarily locking.
No matter what let's keep our tones respectful and avoid getting personal. Talking about anything other than the merits of the submission (e.g. about the poster or reviewer, or tech that has its own approval thread) is unhelpful. Temporarily locking.
I JPed tonight so I didn't get any time to type a post so here's the tl;dr:
I literally just used a wormhole network in my plot (Resurgence Mission 9) so it's established some wormhole networks are out there.
I get that this is basically the door for your new sector you're working on.
The concerns are:
I literally just used a wormhole network in my plot (Resurgence Mission 9) so it's established some wormhole networks are out there.
I get that this is basically the door for your new sector you're working on.
The concerns are:
- That it disrupts the dynamic SARP has relied on for many years in terms of travel times in the Kikyo Sector, altering the feel of the whole setting away from what it's been for over 20 years, kind of like adding Star Trek's warp drive to The Expanse, it'd be a huge game changer.
- That the gates can create wormholes anywhere
- Make it clear in the article that it's a one-off in the Kikyo Sector, that there's one of these that goes to new sector(s) and not a bunch of them in the Kikyo Sector, so that it doesn't disrupt/supplant the existing way travel works in the Kikyo Sector (this is the main thing that would help and get the YSE faction approval thumbs up).
- Clarify/add conditions where a wormhole can be set up
Soban
Convention Veteran
This isn't an article about where specifically the tollgates are placed. I'll leave where exactly they are to other articles and discissions. I'll however note that this is a Essian Company so Essia will have them. Essia isn't leaving Yamatai any time soon which is why it's a YSE thing. It seems entirely plausible to me that the sector generally just doesn't prefer it.
I don't really know what limitations you have in mind here on future tollgates and while I can make some up, the fundamental technologies don't seem to have much limitation as to where they can be placed. Even if we added something like 'can only be set up in proximity to some sort of place in space' type thing, we've already established that Yamatai has a lot of those types of things because of the previous network.
I don't really know what limitations you have in mind here on future tollgates and while I can make some up, the fundamental technologies don't seem to have much limitation as to where they can be placed. Even if we added something like 'can only be set up in proximity to some sort of place in space' type thing, we've already established that Yamatai has a lot of those types of things because of the previous network.
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Okay, then, in order to minimize disruption I am going to say that, for the forseeable future these are limited to Essia system in the Kikyo Sector, which may have the nice side effect of making it a bit of a trade hub.
You know if we put them at Xylar or moved Pisces we could totally have Babylon 5/DS9 type setup lol.
Use in expanded SARPiverse sectors is unlimited and up to those sectors' managers as desired.
You know if we put them at Xylar or moved Pisces we could totally have Babylon 5/DS9 type setup lol.
Use in expanded SARPiverse sectors is unlimited and up to those sectors' managers as desired.
