Wishing to clarify organization roles

[Glein]

Okay, so I just want to voice this question I have aloud, and in a place that can be seen/referred to at a later date. And that is I'm wanting to be sure I'm aware of what two organizations in Yamatai are specifically for, and what kind of things they are expected to perform.

This was a concern I think needed to be done due to this particular post - https://stararmy.com/roleplay-forum/threads/star-army-rifle-type-41-soar.64320/#post-400379 . My main question is on how accurate this is compared to the wiki, and if the wiki is inaccurate, it's made clear so we can update and avoid this particular issue in the future.

So, here we go.

• SAINT - https://wiki.stararmy.com/doku.php?id=stararmy:saint - To quote the opening line of the wiki page: "SAINT is the Star Army of Yamatai's intelligence corps. It is responsible for the collection, analysis, and dissemination of human, signals, sensors, technical, and financial intelligence to Star Army commanders across the galaxy. Additionally, SAINT provides counterintelligence services to safeguard the Yamatai Star Empire's national security." This tells me, that SAINT's primary role is intel, via SIGINT (Signal Intelligence) and HUMINT (Human Intelligence) operations. While I do not doubt they do deploy SOFT units, specifically as Strategic Initiatives Network (SIN). This makes sense to me. What doesn't make sense to me is the idea of them, quote, "SOFT units and SAINT special operations (which are doctrinally SOFTs) almost always deploy in armor", unquote. I would have honestly expected SIN teams to be more likely to deploy without PA because getting exposed in the field is tantamount to suicide for such operations. But, for benefit of the doubt, we'll say it's accurate, then I would not want to do any kind of information giving to a SAINT operative as either a mole or a agent, because if they're always deployed in armor, that risks me, as an asset, who's job is to provide intel to SAINT, being exposed and thusly no longer usable as an asset.
• SOFT - https://wiki.stararmy.com/doku.php?id=stararmy:special_operations_fire_team - I can, and am willing, to concede Raz's point about SOFT deploying in PA quite frequently, but once more, to quote the opening section of the SOFT's page: "A Special Operations Fire Team (SOFT) is a very small, semi-autonomous combat unit used by the Star Army of Yamatai. These units began to appear around YE 37 and are part of Star Army Command and/or Star Army Intelligence. It is based around a small fire team of 4-5 infantry and a handful of support staff. These self-contained groups of elite soldiers are highly skilled at infiltration, intelligence-gathering, and combat." Infiltration, Intelligence-gathering, and combat. Only one of those mission perimeters warrants deploying by nature, in power armor. Infiltration and intelligence gather are covert operations. Missions where the goal is to avoid being identified, in this particular case, as part of the Yamatai military/intel branch, while still getting the information needed to give overt combat forces the information they need to succeed in the missions they partake. The combat mission, yeah, I would deploy in PA, because if I know I'm going into combat, and expect to be in combat, I want to have as good a chance of walking home as I can get.

If I am not correct in my understanding, then please, help me see where I am wrong. I want to be sure I know what I'm working with for these groups and the roles they are supposed to fill so that when I create equipment, such as the Type-41 SOAR first linked in this message, I can put in information correctly and accurately to ensure that the reviewing process is not difficult for myself or the reviewers.

I wish for @raz and @Wes to at the least see this thread, and give their thoughts on the matter, as Wes is FM of Yamatai, and Raz is the one who brought this inconsistency to my attention. Let us all work to correct this fault, whomever may be the one at fault, and ensure everyone can be on the same page. I do apologize for this long rambling thread asking for clarification, but I felt it was needed to ensure I had brought up my points, my concerns, and my understanding of both groups.

 

[raz]

Wes can obviously give the most accurate take on the Star Army as a whole and SOFTs, as he wrote that article. The Star Army's basic infantry doctrine is to deploy soldiers in power armor, so that's the assumption I'm always operating under. Much like how real life infantry are issued body armor, every Rikugun and Uchuugun infantryneko is issued a Daisy or Mindy. While SAINT doesn't have many infantrynekos, its operatives are trained in power armor use and assigned them on as as-needed basis (all SAINT SOFTs are issued power armors in accordance with the SOFT doctrine). As an observation: the article seems to have been written to provide GMs with a unit type that makes sense IC while allowing them to do essentially whatever they wanted with a power armor team that isn't necessarily tied to a plotship.

With regard to Star Army Intelligence and how the currently approved organization/article was designed: SAINT operatives are themselves trained to clandestinely operate behind enemy lines and/or in disguise. This includes deployment in power armor, without power armor, and even with disguised starships. The SOFT organizational doctrine is employed by SAINT in situations that specifically warrant a specialized power armor team's deployment because SAINT has a whole division of field operatives trained to do intelligence work outside of power armor. These SOFTs are called the "Special Deployment Force" within SAINT. They can deploy out of power armor, of course, but my assumption is, again, that the Star Army's infantry uses power armor as a default.

If you wanted to know what SAINT looks for in a weapon perhaps there should have been a quick IC communication broadcast to SAINT operatives like Toshiro did to ship captains and crew when updating the Plumeria-class Gunship. SAINT units are often deployed without logistical support or the ability to get resupplied and that is why I suggested you change the primacy of SAINT's usage of the Type 41 rifle in the article.

 

[Wes]

I feel like this should be obvious, but the Star Army is going to use whatever makes the most sense for its missions on a case by case basis.

 

[Glein]

While I understand that Raz, it is flat out stated as an option for SAINT. An option. They can opt to not use it if they so chose. I have it as an issued item for dedicated SOFT teams because the majority of their work, by the way it's written, is not deploying in power armor outside of outright combat missions. But that disagreement is where you and I are coming to loggerheads. We have very different thoughts on the matter, and because of this the review is on hold, by me, by my choice, until this disagreement is worked out, and a solution that everyone can agree with is made. Which is part of why I asked Wes to give his thoughts on the matter as well as you, with also opening the floor for others to give their own thoughts on things so we can assemble a cohesive answer to potential misunderstandings such as this.

 

[raz]

While I understand that Raz, it is flat out stated as an option for SAINT. An option. They can opt to not use it if they so chose. I have it as an issued item for dedicated SOFT teams because the majority of their work, by the way it's written, is not deploying in power armor outside of outright combat missions. But that disagreement is where you and I are coming to loggerheads. We have very different thoughts on the matter, and because of this the review is on hold, by me, by my choice, until this disagreement is worked out, and a solution that everyone can agree with is made. Which is part of why I asked Wes to give his thoughts on the matter as well as you, with also opening the floor for others to give their own thoughts on things so we can assemble a cohesive answer to potential misunderstandings such as this.

As Wes said, the Star Army uses what makes the most sense for a given mission. Within SAINT's organizational options, the Special Deployment Force is used mostly in their capacity as a power armor unit for hard-hitting special operations missions. SAINT's organizational options are varied and, when a team of elite power armor soldiers aren't needed, there are better tools for the job than the "high speed low drag" SOFTs. SAINT's SOFTs are generally not deployed outside of power armor as a default because specialized teams of operatives can be assigned to work together on a given mission. SAINT's Special Deployment Force and the other SOFT-based unit within SAINT, the Alert Emergency Group — Intelligence Service, are based on the SOFT doctrine but are units that undertake dedicated roles for Star Army Intelligence that are dissimilar to how SOFT units from Star Army Command operate.

EDIT: All I did was make a suggestion about how to make your article better, as any member of this community can, because it's best in prose to lead with who the rifle is for (Rangers) rather than who can optionally use it (SOFT members and SAINT operatives, who choose their loadout per mission and per individual operator). Which is to say, it's better to say, in your own words: "this is rifle designed for Ranger use that SOFTs and SAINT can use" instead of "this is a rifle that SOFTs and SAINT might use but it's really for the Rangers." There really doesn't need to be an entire thread about it. You either take the advice or you don't.

 

[Legix]

On a cat-by-cat basis, I think Yamatai is p gud about realizing that "keepaway" is a bad move. Nepleslia doesn't do it and we're like 500% cooler.

You wanna be cool, don't you guys?