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Approved Submission [Zen Armaments] Terrene Assault Transport

Legix

Legix

Well-Known Member
Submission Type: Ship
Submission URL: https://wiki.stararmy.com/doku.php?id=wip:corp:zen:terrene_assault_transport

Faction: Zen Armaments
FM Approved Yet? Yes
Faction requires art? No

For Reviewers:
Contains Unapproved Sub-Articles? No
Contains New art? Yes
Previously Submitted? No

Notes: @Wes - Here's your civilian market ship to go along with the Jackdaw. It can be bought fairly cheap without any of its outside guns, leaving only with its hangar defense turrets. It's likely to see use in a plot, too, so it'll be unlike most other civilian ships =3=b
 
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It's the first two points Ame. It's owned and operated by the NSMC, and the wording of the article itself is militarized rather than civilian in nature. These are both easy fixes, however, as you're the one reviewing it, your decision on this will be final.
 
How is it not a warship? It meets two of the three required criteria.

It is operated by a military,

And it is primarily designed for combat.

The fluff text throughout the article says this repeatedly.
 
It is primarily a transport ship.

Your perception of article wording does not change that it is this.
 
A transport ship intended for combat, as legix has repeatedly stated.

Which raises the question of if military transports count towards the civilian ship requirements.
 
Ametheliana said:
What Is Considered a Warship?
Click to expand...
Ametheliana said:

A starship is considered a warship if it meets two or more of the following criteria:

The starship is owned and/or operated by a military or paramilitary organization

The starship is primarily designed for combat

The starship has:
More than 4 weapons or offensive systems rated SDR 3/Tier 11 or above.
More than 2 weapons or offensive systems rated SDR 4/Tier 12 or above.
A SDR 5/Tier 13+ weapon.
A “main gun” that takes up a significant portion of the starship.

This is not a warship.
Click to expand...

War is implied in the name and it is fielded by the Nepleslian Space Marine Corps.

For the second point, the word armor comes up 17 times in the article. Civilian ships are not armored to the extent that the Terrene Assault Transport is. I believe that this qualifies it as being designed for war. Not to mention it has a armory, for "power armor storage and gun mounts"

Starliners do not have weapons or armor.
 
To build on that, this is a military ship the same way any landing ship, armored recovery vehicle, or carrier would be a military ship.

The question is do these kinds of ships count as civilian ships for reasons of the 'need a civilian ship' rule.
 
Zack said:
To build on that, this is a military ship the same way any landing ship, armored recovery vehicle, or carrier would be a military ship.

The question is do these kinds of ships count as civilian ships for reasons of the 'need a civilian ship' rule.
Click to expand...
xImmortalxBeauty said:

War is implied in the name and it is fielded by the Nepleslian Space Marine Corps.

For the second point, the word armor comes up 17 times in the article. Civilian ships are not armored to the extent that the Terrene Assault Transport is. I believe that this qualifies it as being designed for war. Not to mention it has a armory, for "power armor storage and gun mounts"

Starliners do not have weapons or armor.
Click to expand...
Firstly: There are other VTOL-type freighters that can accomplish the exact same thing the Terrene does.

https://wiki.stararmy.com/doku.php?id=corp:origin:mule_ultralight_freighter
https://wiki.stararmy.com/doku.php?id=corp:geshrinari_shipyards:products#freighter

Sessou and Jōkyaku have VTOL engines, while a Mule could do the exact same job.

They're not military ships, nor is this.

@xImmortalxBeauty - It has an armory because it's meant to be a merchant's home/base. Merchants hire guards to protect their merchandise. Please go read the article and you'll actually see that.

The Terrene also has armor, but it protect its spine and belly (which even the belly isn't fully protected). Its shields are marginally weaker, but this armor design is specific: it's to help protect the ship IF IT CRASHES!
 
If it's available to ALL parties to purchase then I don't understand the issue... as Ira started above it needed to be civilian OR a support vessel of some kind.

This definitely falls in the "support role."

If that's not right? Then it is still primarily a heavy transport. It is not fielded by only the NSMC and can be purchased by any organazation... which still contributes to the setting as a whole which i believe Wes is after... I fail to see what the issue is here. It's primary role is cargo. Secondary is troop transport if the need arises.

This whole argument is silly and uncalled for. But thats just my 2 cents...
 
Being operated by a military and being intended for combat is what makes this count as a warship.

If this counts as a civilian ship then any military support craft would also count, such as carriers below a certain size, mine layers, landing craft, spy planes, ect.

And I'm not sure that the intent is for more military type craft from the rule.
 
Legix said:
The Terrene also has armor, but it protect its spine and belly (which even the belly isn't fully protected). Its shields are marginally weaker, but this armor design is specific: it's to help protect the ship IF IT CRASHES!
Click to expand...

That's a new one. The words "Crash" or "Accident" are mentioned exactly zero times in the article.
 
It's an issue of semantics. A simple change of wording, and removing mention of the NSMC would get it through with no problem. It's perfectly ok if they adopt it after it's released to the public. It's just that, sometimes, the difference between a warship and an armed merchant is intent.
 
xImmortalxBeauty said:

That's a new one. The words "Crash" or "Accident" are mentioned exactly zero times in the article.
Click to expand...

Armor and Hull-Integrated Systems
The hull and armor of the Terrene consists of two types of materials. The shell-like plating of the Terrene is made of Nerimium, while its frame and inner hull levels are made of Durandium Alloy. As a result, the Terrene tends to endure blows to its shell tremendously well, utilizing the Durandium to provide a reinforced thickness to the shell. However, this also exposes it to certain kinds of missiles or weapons that inflict more damage if they strike harder outer armor, if they bear enough strength to breach the ship's shell.

This is where it's hinted/implied. The fact it's designed along its back is meant to reinforce its structure from "snapping". The ship has VTOL-style engines, where it has to sit itself down.

It's not rocket science.

Edit: Also? The "armor" appearing 17 times? 2 times are as titles, 4 times are as discussing its armoury, 1 loose time is describing power ARMOR, 2 times are in the TOC, and another is for GROUND ARMOR, such as tanks. Math for you?

10 of those times have no relation to the armor of the ship.
 
Given the rest of the article, it still comes off as rather militaristic Legix. If you had it say something more like, "endure blows from pirates and raiders" for an example, and use that sort of defensive language throughout consistently, the article would be much better off.
 
Legix said:
Edit: Also? The "armor" appearing 17 times? 2 times are as titles, 4 times are as discussing its armoury, 1 loose time is describing power ARMOR, 2 times are in the TOC, and another is for GROUND ARMOR, such as tanks. Math for you?

10 of those times have no relation to the armor of the ship.
Click to expand...

It kills tanks too? Why would a merchant fight a tank? This all sounds very offensive and militaristic in nature to me.
 
CadetNewb said:
Give n the rest of the article, it still comes off as rather militaristic Legix. If you had it say something more like, "endure blows from pirates and raiders" for an example, and use that sort of defensive language throughout consistently, the article would be much better off.
Click to expand...
This whole thing about its "wording" and "intent" is absurd. The "intent" you view isn't what it is. It survives. If there are more instances that are triggering people into thinking it's aggressive, then please cite more sections and I will change it.

Because again: this has been whining and nitpicking, but zero ideas that are realistic beyond "try to reword it and good luck!".

xImmortalxBeauty said:

It kills tanks too? Why would a merchant fight a tank?
Click to expand...
It has point-defense turrets that are T9. That is essentially a Heavy Tank cannon. And those are intended to be guns to protect the ship. Logically, it could assault/kill ground armor that threatens it (because it is at most danger to attacks from directly below, where it has a gap in its armor to allow proper landing).

Not to mention there are tanks sold to anyone with the cash. You can find them from Origin and I believe another company, but tanks are sold to anyone with cash, which could pirate/harm a merchant. And people will get the best/most available stuff if they want to knock over merchants, even if it's ridiculous. It's why we have people who try to commit piracy with rafts against large cargo ships.
 
Nitpick police on full alert, trying to get my submission thrown out as military. I wonder if any of you have actually read the article beyond trying to piece it out for each individual attempt at nitpicking it. Probably not.
 
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