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Approved Submission [Zen Armaments] Terrene Assault Transport

Legix

Legix

Inactive Member
Submission Type: Ship
Submission URL: https://wiki.stararmy.com/doku.php?id=wip:corp:zen:terrene_assault_transport

Faction: Zen Armaments
FM Approved Yet? Yes
Faction requires art? No

For Reviewers:
Contains Unapproved Sub-Articles? No
Contains New art? Yes
Previously Submitted? No

Notes: @Wes - Here's your civilian market ship to go along with the Jackdaw. It can be bought fairly cheap without any of its outside guns, leaving only with its hangar defense turrets. It's likely to see use in a plot, too, so it'll be unlike most other civilian ships =3=b
 
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Which USO craft are you referring to? Although previous submissions aren't allowed to be used as a reason for approving new ones anyway so I don't know why it matters.
 
I don't really see this as debatable. Combat is listed in the mission specialization of the ship, and it is operated by a military organization. That means it counts as a military ship under the military buildup limitations.

At best you could argue that the non-gun version could count as a civilian ship, which means this might count as its own civillian ship submission, but I think that's a bit iffy. I think you'd need a separate area in the ship article at least to show the different variants.
 
ArsenicJohn said:
Which USO craft are you referring to? Although previous submissions aren't allowed to be used as a reason for approving new ones anyway so I don't know why it matters.
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According to the Submission Rules, previous submissions are not allowed to be used as justification for a new submission's overpowered and/or questionable abilities, @ArsenicJohn. That, however, is not what these "concerns" are about in my opinion.
 
Zack said:
I don't really see this as debatable. Combat is listed in the mission specialization of the ship, and it is operated by a military organization. That means it counts as a military ship under the military buildup limitations.

At best you could argue that the non-gun version could count as a civilian ship, which means this might count as its own civillian ship submission, but I think that's a bit iffy. I think you'd need a separate area in the ship article at least to show the different variants.
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You don't think it's iffy. You know this is a civilian ship. You're just trying to word-play it because they sell to Nepleslia and you HAVE to derail the submission because Arieg is being forced to follow the rules just as I was asked to when I created this.

Any good transport will be designed to survive through combat/hostile areas. If not, then what's the purpose of designing it? Not only that, but the hazards of space warrant its protective shell and the protective guns it has.

It isn't a military ship. It's a transport with the word "assault" on it that has two variants that strip it of its firepower to emphasize it's a transport and not a warship.

This is seriously pathetic, especially given that it had been sitting on the NTSE for a good while now, yet only when Arieg was told about the rule and held to it did you decide to chime in. It's personal motivation trying to stretch and lie to make this a warship.

It isn't. It's not a military ship.
 
I don't understand your points.

Are you saying this ship isn't intended for use by the Nepleslian military?

Or that the ship is not intended for combat missions?

The submission indicates both are true.
 
Zack said:
I don't understand your points.

Are you saying this ship isn't intended for use by the Nepleslian military?

Or that the ship is not intended for combat missions?

The submission indicates both are true.
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It is NOT intended for the Nepleslian military.

It IS intended for civilian merchants and groups. Paramilitary COULD be included, but no different than the ship COULD be sold to Nepleslia.

The ship is intended to SURVIVE combat missions.

It is not intended to undergo them entirely as a standardized military warship.
 
Zack said:
Pick one.
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If there are any USO designs that are sold to their government (which is effectively its military) or sold to anyone with money, then you'd be breaking your personal view on the rule.

Please inform me if this is still how you'll choose to interpret the rule.
 
USO designs are intended for use by the USO. While it is debatable if they are a military organization, they certainly are a paramilitary one.

There are plenty of USO designs that are meant for Uso, but do not meet any of the other qualifications for being a warship. Since you have to meet 2 of the 3 requirements to be considered a military ship I don't see what the problem is.
 
Generally in the old military build up rules wiki. It says for every military ship, a support/civilian rig should be made(used to be for every two) said non direct military/civilian ship could only have so many guns and it's role had to be something other than blowing stuff up. If I'm wrong plz correcticles me
 
Secondly what is the outcome wanted by this? Wouldn't it be easier to say y'all don't want USO ships put into the NTSE anymore? I'm curious to know what the goal of this argument is? Zack's is clear. He wants this article approved so it can be put to use.
 
Ira said:
Secondly what is the outcome wanted by this? Wouldn't it be easier to say y'all don't want USO ships put into the NTSE anymore? I'm curious to know what the goal of this argument is? Zack's is clear. He wants this article approved so it can be put to use.
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Zack wants this article stalled.

There isn't anything wrong with it beyond maybe it having the word "Assault" in its name. Anyone who actually read the ship's wiki could see that it CAN be an assault ship, that it CAN be sold to people. Doesn't mean it's exclusively sold to anyone. I put Nepleslia as an example and he started to raise hell on it.

The intentions of the Terrene were to provide a freighter/transport that can protect itself. The Geshrinari freighters with VTOL abilities can literally do the exact same thing this can. Nothing was wrong with that and its ability to protect and assault positions. This is considerably weaker. Not only that, but your prior statement?
Ira said:
Generally in the old military build up rules wiki. It says for every military ship, a support/civilian rig should be made(used to be for every two) said non direct military/civilian ship could only have so many guns and it's role had to be something other than blowing stuff up. If I'm wrong plz correcticles me
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The Terrene doesn't "blow things up".

Mission Specialization
  • Supply Missions
  • Basic and Hostile Territory Merchant Ship
  • Air Superiority/Planetary Combat
  • Mobile Headquarters
It has guns to protect itself or to clear landing areas. Its gun is as useful shooting infantry as it would be for blowing away debris. Not only that, but it has various levels of removing its guns.

Please: Before you guys come to my submission trying to start this, at least read more than its name and look at its image. It isn't some WARSHIP. It's not even a very viable military ship (its shield and protective abilities are minimal compared to ships of equal size).
 
Legix, Zack is right. All you need to do is change the wording and language in the article. After that, it's no longer a military ship.
 
Please highlight these instances in each part so I can correct it, then. Because this is simply absurd. There wasn't any issue and @Ametheliana, @Soresu, and others had all seen this as a simple civilian ship. I have genuinely no idea beyond maybe calling it a Transport rather than an Assault Transport.
 
I'm not the one reviewing it, but they've already laid out the gist of it. Get rid of words like "Assault", anything that suggests it going on the attack or participating in an attack, and remove the NSMC from the user's list. It's ok if it's released on the market as a civilian ship with defensive capability, but the military happens to want to use it after it's on the market.
 
You're not reviewing the article, and honestly, its name fits its intention to protect and assault landings to deliver/get away with its goods. If you're too lazy to highlight all the wording, then it's a good thing you're not reviewing it. It supplies and acts as a merchant ship within both friendly AND HOSTILE terrain.

Not only that, but Nepleslia IS AN EXAMPLE. It's not exclusive. That's why there's a "many more". The ship can be bought and likely WILL be bought by militaries that lack a transport. Zen sells to anyone.
CadetNewb said:
It's ok if it's released on the market as a civilian ship with defensive capability, but the military happens to want to use it after it's on the market..
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It's on the civilian market and the military happens to use it. That's literally what my example means. That's why Zen is the only manufacturer/seller.
 
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