mizunoyoroko
Inactive Member
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[UOC]Quantum Construction System
- Thread starter mizunoyoroko
- Start date
This system works at the atomic level manipulating molecules into new types to make things.
Living creatures, as composed primarily of CHON, (Carbon, Hydrogen, Oxygen, Nitrogen), and so are all forms on organic material. There is no difference between the atoms of a living organism and that of inert organic material. So how can the system be programmed to not work on living creatures, but make organic material.
Living creatures, as composed primarily of CHON, (Carbon, Hydrogen, Oxygen, Nitrogen), and so are all forms on organic material. There is no difference between the atoms of a living organism and that of inert organic material. So how can the system be programmed to not work on living creatures, but make organic material.
mizunoyoroko
Inactive Member
That's true, however the ship does have internal sensors, through the use of internal sensors it's possible to avoid modification of living beings.
How are the nanomachines controlled?
To be honest, this seems too magical and advanced. It's like the pre-nerf Nodal System, but capable of even more.
We need to get away from this untrue idea that nanomachines do everything better than actual machines.
To be honest, this seems too magical and advanced. It's like the pre-nerf Nodal System, but capable of even more.
We need to get away from this untrue idea that nanomachines do everything better than actual machines.
mizunoyoroko
Inactive Member
Alright, I made some changes.
Concerning your question wes, it actually doesn't use femtomachines which is what makes it different. I added in more information concerning how it works, but a lot of it is really too advanced for me myself to understand. Creating objects using quantum technology has been done before (quanta-construct), and the UOC has power technology and computer technology (MIKO) based off of quantum mechanics.
As for magical-ness, I can totally understand that. I didn't want folks abusing it either so I looked at the Nodal system as a model and a limiter. The only thing that's really different is that it's not unhealthy to be around. I definetly think that things should take time to do, regardless of system being used.
On another note, Nashoba, one concern that was raised was power consumption. You mentioned that this would take a considerable amount of power, it does. That's a limiting factor really, the system more or less requires a dedicated power source (a Link Siphon, or Qauntum Foam, or a really big dedicated antimatter reactor). Regardless, the system will not be functioning at 100% all the time. Heck, the ship won't be producing equipment and stuff in the fabrication bays all the time either.
Another note I'll make is this system IS the holographic system. Rather than have multiple emitter types laced throughout the interior of a ship, just line it with the type necessary for the QCS which produces holography anyway. It's quicker to manipulate something and change simple properties such as the color, whereas creating a physical object would require many many changes.
Concerning your question wes, it actually doesn't use femtomachines which is what makes it different. I added in more information concerning how it works, but a lot of it is really too advanced for me myself to understand. Creating objects using quantum technology has been done before (quanta-construct), and the UOC has power technology and computer technology (MIKO) based off of quantum mechanics.
As for magical-ness, I can totally understand that. I didn't want folks abusing it either so I looked at the Nodal system as a model and a limiter. The only thing that's really different is that it's not unhealthy to be around. I definetly think that things should take time to do, regardless of system being used.
On another note, Nashoba, one concern that was raised was power consumption. You mentioned that this would take a considerable amount of power, it does. That's a limiting factor really, the system more or less requires a dedicated power source (a Link Siphon, or Qauntum Foam, or a really big dedicated antimatter reactor). Regardless, the system will not be functioning at 100% all the time. Heck, the ship won't be producing equipment and stuff in the fabrication bays all the time either.
Another note I'll make is this system IS the holographic system. Rather than have multiple emitter types laced throughout the interior of a ship, just line it with the type necessary for the QCS which produces holography anyway. It's quicker to manipulate something and change simple properties such as the color, whereas creating a physical object would require many many changes.
Yoroko,
You misunderstood what I was getting at in IRC.
I have no problem with the concept of this or the Nodal system, I just think that they should be kept in a specific part of the ship, they make very useful tools to repair, and reuse items. Or create one by turning x amount of raw material into desired product.
What I do not see is the value of trying to use either technology for the convenience of making holographic displays anywhere you want. It would be easier with the tech level of Yamatai and the UOC to just have holo-emitters or volumetric display emitters through the ship.
The most likely time that a person would have a critical need for a holographic display when not at a normal station would be during combat or during an emergency. A time that the energy to create the display components on the fly could be better used for other systems.
You misunderstood what I was getting at in IRC.
I have no problem with the concept of this or the Nodal system, I just think that they should be kept in a specific part of the ship, they make very useful tools to repair, and reuse items. Or create one by turning x amount of raw material into desired product.
What I do not see is the value of trying to use either technology for the convenience of making holographic displays anywhere you want. It would be easier with the tech level of Yamatai and the UOC to just have holo-emitters or volumetric display emitters through the ship.
The most likely time that a person would have a critical need for a holographic display when not at a normal station would be during combat or during an emergency. A time that the energy to create the display components on the fly could be better used for other systems.
OsakanOne
Retired Member
What kind of things can be built with it, in all seriousness?
I would imagine if it's a flat "externally built" nano system, it really is only suitable for limited production of fairly small objects, with the largest being no bigger than a grain of rice or a marble (which would be pushing it but for the sheer precision you get and the fact the SARP is a fantasy setting, it's acceptable).
Ideal things would be quantum-computer parts, processors, electronics, tracking devices and so forth.
Keep in mind: If you are building something that small at even an immense speed, it would take an ungodly amount of time to produce anything of any size. Even a grain of rice in an advanced system would take years unless the product were self-replicating which is why it takes days for mold to appear -- And mold has a density barely thicker than air.
It would be faster to grow food from a seed than it would be to build it atom by painstaking atom, even if you're doing a few billion atoms every second. In a standard hospital razor sharp needle point, there are approximately 7*10^27 atoms, which if you were working at that billion a second rate would take you something roughly along the lines of about one 1600 years.
Now what makes this system especially "quantum"?
An easier way?
This has been the OsakanOne's helping hand.
Signing out. :3
I would imagine if it's a flat "externally built" nano system, it really is only suitable for limited production of fairly small objects, with the largest being no bigger than a grain of rice or a marble (which would be pushing it but for the sheer precision you get and the fact the SARP is a fantasy setting, it's acceptable).
Ideal things would be quantum-computer parts, processors, electronics, tracking devices and so forth.
Keep in mind: If you are building something that small at even an immense speed, it would take an ungodly amount of time to produce anything of any size. Even a grain of rice in an advanced system would take years unless the product were self-replicating which is why it takes days for mold to appear -- And mold has a density barely thicker than air.
It would be faster to grow food from a seed than it would be to build it atom by painstaking atom, even if you're doing a few billion atoms every second. In a standard hospital razor sharp needle point, there are approximately 7*10^27 atoms, which if you were working at that billion a second rate would take you something roughly along the lines of about one 1600 years.
Now what makes this system especially "quantum"?
An easier way?
How about producing lots of neat self-organizing self-replicating parts that copy the most common chains of molecules very very quickly. It isn't atomically accurate to the original atom, since it is a self-replicating system but it has most of the normal properties - to the point where you'd seriously never know it was a fake at our scale of existence - or even that of cells and bacteria.
Under set conditions, the self-replicating layer then releases whatever excesses of self-replicating parts it had which are washed away under magnetic resonance treatment.
Next, you sandwich the layers to get big blocks of refined materials. If you need a specific manufacturing outcome, just cut the layers as you sandwich them together to form pathways for the introduction of other refined materials so you get interesting mixtures and treat them by either cooling or heating them or compressing on the fly to produce various layers.
Using this system, you could create anything from a big panel of armor to liver cells to an aero-bar.
Finally, shave off the exterior and add a finnish - the external membrane of a cell or delicious chocolate.
Condense the components that come out of your self-replicating materials and refinement farm together in the proper order and you start producing useful materials.
Visually, I figure this "factory" would look like a giant sphere composed of a skin of smaller spheres composed of honey-combs - each cell producing a part then feeding out into the weightless primary chamber for assembly.
It would be critical the chamber remain utterly sterile and the conditions would be remarkably hostile to life: I can't imagine wanting to put my hand into something the size of a medicine ball from a larger atomic construction chamber then taking it out to find my skin has been merged with chocolate and eating said chocolate would peel my own skin away as if I were a third degree burn victim.
The only disadvantage I can see is if you look at the product microscopically, you can see how well organized it is (unnaturally so, revealing its artificial nature -- "Not fish: Snake scale!") and deduce the skill of the maker or the systems involved in producing it (ergo the manufacturer if you're a good slouth and they don't cover their trail well - which could be good for roleplay - examining a corpse to reveal it's artificial or wreckage or a murder weapon used upon some high ranking officer that would have spurred mutany - Undiscovered country, anyone?).
OR... It COULD make for some interesting torture, though...
This has been the OsakanOne's helping hand.
Signing out. :3
mizunoyoroko
Inactive Member
Yoroko,
You misunderstood what I was getting at in IRC.
I have no problem with the concept of this or the Nodal system, I just think that they should be kept in a specific part of the ship, they make very useful tools to repair, and reuse items. Or create one by turning x amount of raw material into desired product.
What I do not see is the value of trying to use either technology for the convenience of making holographic displays anywhere you want. It would be easier with the tech level of Yamatai and the UOC to just have holo-emitters or volumetric display emitters through the ship.
The most likely time that a person would have a critical need for a holographic display when not at a normal station would be during combat or during an emergency. A time that the energy to create the display components on the fly could be better used for other systems.
----
@Nashoba: I see where you're coming from, but I kinda feel like it just adds to the complexity. The system is capable of creating holographics relatively easily. Rather than have two systems drawing power from the ship one is simpler, plus in terms of repairs its easier to have to repair only one system. Though it does leave a significant issue if that system takes damage as there is a lack of redundancy.
@Osaka: It can make practically anything, though for gameplay sake it'd probably be limited to military hardware as necessary (power armors, drone fighters, etc). As for time consumption that's going to be true of any molecular scale system, nodal, qcs, or other. Fortunately however this is a science fiction setting and we can suspend the concept of realism since we lack the technology to do almost all of what is part of the setting. Even so, the technology has been used before, the Phoenix Corporation's trademarked Quanta-Construct(TM) technology.
On another note though Osaka, what you're talking about is a system that works on one molecule at a time, this works on the entire area simultaneously.
You misunderstood what I was getting at in IRC.
I have no problem with the concept of this or the Nodal system, I just think that they should be kept in a specific part of the ship, they make very useful tools to repair, and reuse items. Or create one by turning x amount of raw material into desired product.
What I do not see is the value of trying to use either technology for the convenience of making holographic displays anywhere you want. It would be easier with the tech level of Yamatai and the UOC to just have holo-emitters or volumetric display emitters through the ship.
The most likely time that a person would have a critical need for a holographic display when not at a normal station would be during combat or during an emergency. A time that the energy to create the display components on the fly could be better used for other systems.
----
@Nashoba: I see where you're coming from, but I kinda feel like it just adds to the complexity. The system is capable of creating holographics relatively easily. Rather than have two systems drawing power from the ship one is simpler, plus in terms of repairs its easier to have to repair only one system. Though it does leave a significant issue if that system takes damage as there is a lack of redundancy.
@Osaka: It can make practically anything, though for gameplay sake it'd probably be limited to military hardware as necessary (power armors, drone fighters, etc). As for time consumption that's going to be true of any molecular scale system, nodal, qcs, or other. Fortunately however this is a science fiction setting and we can suspend the concept of realism since we lack the technology to do almost all of what is part of the setting. Even so, the technology has been used before, the Phoenix Corporation's trademarked Quanta-Construct(TM) technology.
On another note though Osaka, what you're talking about is a system that works on one molecule at a time, this works on the entire area simultaneously.
OsakanOne
Retired Member
Yeah but if you do that, you run into signal blocking unless you're dealing with entangulation for which you'd need to have an original pattern - an existing construct pre-built for it to replicate - unless you can fool it some how.
Out of curiosity, how big is QuantaConstruct?
What stops you mounting it on something like a powered-armor to generate weapons-configurations while in cover so when you come out of cover, you can change your effective combat class?
Out of curiosity, how big is QuantaConstruct?
What stops you mounting it on something like a powered-armor to generate weapons-configurations while in cover so when you come out of cover, you can change your effective combat class?
mizunoyoroko
Inactive Member
Like I said, quantum mechanics are a little bit complicated. I figure that this was all figured out by people smarter than me ICly. As for the size of QuantaConstruct, the original, it was a pad. This system is just built into the inner hull of the ship so that it's usable anywhere (though anything larger than a cat is constructed in fabrication bays).
The biggest issue with mounting it on power armor etc. is that it takes an excessive amount of power to use. Utilizing it on anything smaller than a starship is near impossible and highly impractical due to power issues, power armors and small vehicles don't produce near enough energy on their own to really do that. Besides, it'd be a tad overpowered OOCly to be able to do that.
The biggest issue with mounting it on power armor etc. is that it takes an excessive amount of power to use. Utilizing it on anything smaller than a starship is near impossible and highly impractical due to power issues, power armors and small vehicles don't produce near enough energy on their own to really do that. Besides, it'd be a tad overpowered OOCly to be able to do that.
mizunoyoroko
Inactive Member
Anything on this?
mizunoyoroko
Inactive Member
My goal here isn't Star Trek. I can put in that things like transportation are not something feasible. Other than that it has the same functions as the Nodal System, the real difference is it's not unhealthy to be around basically, and the fluff text that makes it work of course.
edit: I can see your point with the replicators. I personally wouldn't be a fan of using it in this fashion. I tried to kinda make it seem very impractical to use the system for that purpose in general though still feasible on a very small scale (just like using the Nodal System to make food, the difference is this could make different foods but eh).
edit: I can see your point with the replicators. I personally wouldn't be a fan of using it in this fashion. I tried to kinda make it seem very impractical to use the system for that purpose in general though still feasible on a very small scale (just like using the Nodal System to make food, the difference is this could make different foods but eh).
mizunoyoroko
Inactive Member
Bumping and changing my last comment a little (sometimes I hate double posts).
@Wes: Transporting is an impossibility with this system, flat out. It states at least a few times that the QCS cannot be used on living beings in any way whatsoever.
I've reworded the section concerning food. It's now been disabled by default, it's pretty clearly stated now that it is time consuming and a drain on the power grid.
@Wes: Transporting is an impossibility with this system, flat out. It states at least a few times that the QCS cannot be used on living beings in any way whatsoever.
I've reworded the section concerning food. It's now been disabled by default, it's pretty clearly stated now that it is time consuming and a drain on the power grid.
mizunoyoroko
Inactive Member
Wes: I've addressed your concnerns. Bump for approval.
I looked at this and objectively speaking I think it should pass.
This article has a lot of good things:
So I talked to a couple of people on SARP and this is what they had to say:
https://stararmy.com/roleplay/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1688&start=550
To make epically long story short, I now know your talking about is something different then what I originally thought and conceptually similar to fake mishhu in this picture, so Wes it looks good to approve especially for the reason I listed way above at the top.
This article has a lot of good things:
- Readable and well written
- Was Very specific about what the device made and cannot made
- Has the "much more" line
- Mentioned exactly what it can be put on
- If its outside fabrication bay, mentioned the limit to the size of things that can be made
Thus I was confused by this initially. However, didn't want to pull a huge objective zombie Fineman about optical devices and need for photo-lithography, unless 100% sure I knew what you where talking about used those specific things and 100% sure it was objectively necessary.
So I talked to a couple of people on SARP and this is what they had to say:
https://stararmy.com/roleplay/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1688&start=550
To make epically long story short, I now know your talking about is something different then what I originally thought and conceptually similar to fake mishhu in this picture, so Wes it looks good to approve especially for the reason I listed way above at the top.
