Uniform Updates for the Star Army of Yamatai

[Aendri]

The fact that almost every SF soldier I've ever known utterly hates that velcro is beside the point when someone in a lab somewhere thinks it's good for the Army, right? Uniforms irl aren't decided on by the soldiers who have to use them, and if they were, I highly doubt you'd ever see velcro on them, so using that as justification seems kinda silly.

 

[Wes]

Here's an image showing placement of enlisted ranks (Itto Heisho chevrons shown).

Officer version below:

 

[CadetNewb]

I honestly feel that this new jacket its being rushed forward far too fast. Still, as I said before, I gave this a shot.



It's rough, but I felt that overall, something like this would fit the Star Army more, since its cut is sleeker and less angular. The previous iteration of the working uniform still stays relevant as well, and it prevents the inventory of existing uniforms from getting larger. It could use more pockets, but again, this is a rough - I've only started messing with GIMP today. Along the lines that Reynolds and Amaryllis said, this would be the 'default state'. The idea was that the uniform can be made to automatically change camo patterns if we use some sort of substance on it. I personally prefer smart-pigments over nanomachines though.

Those are just a headache.

 

[Aendri]

We already have color-changing fabrics listed in the custom apparel guide for less than 200ks. Why would it be so hard to make uniforms out of that instead?

 

[Wes]

The existing working uniform is not going away. It's only being replaced for the ground forces. Space fleet forces will continue to get the dark blue working uniform. One of the reasons I made a new top is because the working uniform has decorative piping, which is unsuitable for a field uniform.

We already have color-changing fabrics listed in the custom apparel guide for less than 200ks. Why would it be so hard to make uniforms out of that instead?

If you read the jacket article, you would have seen it's available already. Edit: Added cost info to jacket article.

Here's some Frankenstein creation I made showing what our uniform concept looks like at present. I'm still figuring out what kind of headgear to use.

 

[Aendri]

I think the grey top from Cadet's image looks much better as a default coloring. It fits with the general uniform styling much better.

 

[CadetNewb]

That's a relief to hear.

Still, couldn't the decorative piping just be swapped out when used by ground forces? What other reasons are there for having the jacket?

 

[Wes]

What other reasons are there for having the jacket?

Well, the jacket provides pockets, and it's made out of something stronger than basically spandex (the working uniform top is like an underarmor fitness shirt basically), and it's very fire-resistant. The shoulder straps give it a more military appearance like the duty uniform and are there for possible future use as places to put rank or other insignia.

Guys, after going through so many redesigns based on feedback I'm invested in and settled on this version of the top. I got the art made, the pages made, and I'm satisfied. I want to move on to other parts of this uniform and to the other uniforms like the new exercise suit.

Spoiler: Bonus

Edit: Here's the new jacket in multi-cam. It actually looks pretty impressive but we don't have rights to the pattern so it's a no-go for actual use (also, back to the thing about avoiding patterns to help our art stay consistent).

 

[CadetNewb]

I already covered the concept of pockets - what I did was just a quick rough. Pockets can be added in easily enough. The same with the rank bits. Also, I doubt that the Working Uniform is so flimsy as you say. The article explicitly states that it's tough, and it honestly has to be if it's used by engineers crawling through ducts and fixing ships. Even if it wasn't tough enough, a Type 30B for ground use that did fit the bill wouldn't be far off.

As for development of the jacket, it feels like it was rushed forward, irregardless of criticism. Yeah, I even gave feedback on that same jacket, but only because I felt it was the best thing to do if it was going to be forced. Even then, we're still back to velcro when good reason not to use it has been put forward. Plus, the alternative for the jacket - the modified Working Uniform - was never properly addressed. A small flaw here and there would get pointed to and even countered, but it never felt like an actual discussion about what uniform would be better was being had.

That jacket just kept on coming no matter what anyone said.

 

[Aendri]

Using the fact that you've made art for it despite continued objections as an excuse to move on is a remarkably flimsy excuse. Maybe stop making art for stuff until we're done discussing things, if it's that big of a deal for you? Cadet is obviously trying to help out by arting stuff that you haven't for us to give feedback on - should we discount the time he's putting into this?

Outside of that, I honestly haven't heard a single good reason for the velcro to be used in any uniform for the SAoY. It's never been required before, and we've had lots of uniforms.

 

[Yoshi]

@Wes , just a heads up, Multicam is a trademarked camouflage. I know you try to avoid things that are, so I figured I'd throw this up at you. beyond that I love that multi-cam jacket and want on IRL!

 

[CadetNewb]

He did mention that - it was only done for looks.

 

[Reynolds]

Along the same lines as Caedet's idea, here's kinda what I was picturing.

Spoiler

Just making the V-line mean something by having a different shade, here matching the pants. And then repeating the V-line on the pants with another shade-swap. It also makes you recall the old bodysuits and their sections on the pants and usage of alternating colors.

 

[Wes]

Why the insistence on two-tone, folks? One the goals of this uniform is to get it down to to one main color or as close to it as possible. This is a field uniform, so its "fashion" should come from the shape rather than the color. I mean, you wouldn't expect a real uniform to have a combination of ACU and BDU patterns on a single shirt or pair of pants. And maybe that's my fault for not clearly outlining my goals for the utility uniform from the outset, but I wasn't trying to set up a competition or get members to submit designs either.

If we take away the colors from the working uniform it's basically featureless, and that's why I decided to make a new top that had more shape to it. The line in the middle is there for style (gives it a "Star Army of Yamatai" look and carries over a look from the working uniform) and visual feel (it makes the jacket look more substantial and not just like a normal shirt).

As for velcro, the idea is that speed and ease of use is more important than stealth.

The look is a hybrid between the old working uniform and the current duty uniform (Type 35), and real-life ACU, and I like that combination very much. The color is based on suggestions in this thread. The shaped (getting rid of the flap) is based on the suggestions in the thread, and I got rid of all but two patches of the hook-and-pile (Velcro type) based on the suggestions in the thread. Basically, what I'm saying is that the way the jacket ended up is a already result of compromises between my original idea and your input.

 

[Sigma]

Yamatai. Copying Nepleslia's colors and joining the Greens. Does this mean the Reds have to wear Green?

 

[Jimmy]

Great. Another uniform no one will ever wear and which will get replaced after two years anyway with something we give even less of a fig about. Probably even uglier too.

 

[CadetNewb]

Sigma, even though I'm a Nepleslian GM, even I got to admit we don't have a monopoly on green. It's a practical color. What matters more is how the color is arranged thanks to the cut of the clothing. Just the way two different factions use the same color should say something about each. Emphasis on should - it's why I don't like the jacket. It's not sleek, refined and futuristic looking. Hell, it's uncomfortably Nepleslian in a sense.

*****

And what Jimmy said. Think 'big picture' Wes.

When doing something to nurture and have the site grow, it isn't so much about our own individual wants anymore. Instead, it's all about the playerbase, and what they want. Hell, if I had my way, we'd be using the Type 31 Field Uniform, but it isn't about what I want at all. Even going with the idea of a modified Working Uniform is a concession, but one that would not only be Yamataian, but something that the players would like. I don't like doing that since I prefer the Field Uniform, but they likely do, so it's why I'm pushing for that. I know I can only take educated guesses as to what most players would like, but my impression is that the Jacket isn't up their alley. It just wouldn't look good on a Neko. Having it be bi-color for aesthetic purposes when its camouflage is not in use wouldn't hurt, and the shoulders come off as too stiff and formal. Something that hugs and emphasizes them would be ideal. Hence, working uniform.

It seems that Type 30 and 31 stuff is the peak of Yamataian uniform design, and after that, not so much.

 

[Syaoran]

You know it just hit me, but I think the PC ground force fleet is going on hiatus anyway soon. So even if we make these uniforms they wont exactly be used in any art for a while. And I see why there's want for a new uniform, and want to keep the old ones. But the real question comes down to, are the players going to have a use for it? I mean I can't picture this uniform really being used in a space fleet it just seems like a ground troops thing. But we don't have any ground troops. So because of that I don't really a reason to rush through the production of the uniform. I think it's better if we sit down and weigh out and define exactly what 'hole' there is in the current uniforms if there is one, and then if there is one maybe build a uniform for that, instead of replacing what we already have. That way we get a new uniform without invalidating artwork.

 

[CadetNewb]

This wasn't going to replace any pre-existing uniforms, but I agree that it's all been way, way too fast.

 

[Moogle]

As a player in a Yamataian plot once more, I'd just like to say that I don't particularly think this uniform solves any problems that the previous uniforms couldn't have already solved. Plus the green don't look so hot on a cat, ya dig?