About to go to bed, but I will be saying this just because it can be said quickly. Soul Transfer is Elysian technology. And so are the Seraphs. Even if you upgrade them they still originated from Elysian Tech. So yes, Elysian tech is involved in all this.
What you two need to start doing is firstly, talk -to- each other. That means Frost you need to start focusing on what's actually important that'll effect you. And Zack that means you need to stop talking around Frost. You two are going to get no where if there's no discourse of compromise.
And Zack 500 million as a population is fine. What isn't' fine is 500 million -Patricians-. We have asked you so many times for "How many Patricians are there" and you don't answer. And for the record, if they are using a 'made' body they are technically not Patrician. Patricians are a 'natural' race. Yes you can have them make bodies that are just like Patricians if you want, but a number of -natural- Patricians that left would be nice.
If you two can't start actually talking to each other you're both gonna be here forever and neither of you will likely get what you want, but you're both looking really childish right now that you can't even figure out how to hold a conversation between each other.
Does anyone have any specific changes or additions to the text of Zack's article they'd like to suggest? Hopefully from
@FrostJaeger since he's the guy who matters right now. Because that's what should be happening, rather than long posts generally critiquing the article.
Wes has all but approved it. Say exactly what you think Zack should be adding/subtracting so he has solid points to work off of. Right now you're just giving him "that's not cool I don't like this!" posts, which isn't productive.
Given that the above quotes (emphasis mine) are quite accurate regarding the abysmal state of this thread, let's put an end to our roundabout bickering here and now, shall we?
@Zack, I'm quite aware that we rarely (if ever) see eye-to-eye on things, so let me make this clear:
The reason I requested so much content on the wiki in my
previous posts is
not because of any personal animosity I feel towards you - it's because I, as the
Faction Manager of
Elysia, want to improve upon the currently dreadful quality of
Elysian articles, many of which are physically painful for me to read. I saw this as a launching point of that concept, as something that I could point to and say "
that is the level of quality submissions for
Elysia should have" when evaluating future submissions.
This thread has made it abundantly clear that such an approach just isn't tenable, given that it comes off as me being "arbitrary," and has also made me realize that it's really just laziness on my behalf - so you know what?
While looking up pre-existing "standards" for faction submissions (due to
@Zack requesting such)...
[...]
Zack would also love to be held to the same reasonable standards that everyone else is.
[...]
...I stumbled across
this section of the "
Creating a Species" guide on the wiki. It suggests that the following should be submitted when
initially "adding a new culture" to the setting...
The Wiki Article said:
- Start with art! Concept art is required.
- Initial Submissions (try to submit these at the same time):
- Species biology and basic culture
- Star System
- Planet (species' homeworld)
...and, though I can't say I'm entirely pleased with their paucity, I
can certainly say that I'd be willing to compromise with you,
@Zack, over the question of "how much is enough" via these guidelines.
Seeing as how
Elysia already has "concept artwork" (as evidenced
here, for example) the first requirement has already been satisfied. Although the biology requirements haven't (in my opinion) really been satisfied, it's not something that I'm going to burden you with
@Zack (as it's something
I need to work on); regarding the species' culture and cultural quirks, the former is something that's already
covered in the
4th Great Elysian Celestial Empire article. The section still could use more detail, in my opinion - but that, as stated above, is something I'm no longer going to bother pursuing, given how "arbitrary" comes across as.
What this means for you,
@Zack, is that there are now only two other articles I'd like to see submitted - not approved, just submitted - before giving my approval of this concept:
- An article detailing the star system of Purgatory.
- An article detailing the "new Elysian homeworld" mentioned in the same section.
For the question of how many
Patricians is an "acceptable" amount, my response is to politely request the following:
@Zack, would you mind adding somewhere on the
4th Great Elysian Celestial Empire article - either in the infobox at the top of the page or in its own section - the demographics on the of the roughly 500 million individuals living on the aforementioned planet?
What I'm looking for in particular are figures that describe how many of those 500 million are
Patricians, how many are
ST clones, and how many are
Plebeians or
Caelisolans. 500 million
Patricians is admittedly still too many of them in my opinion - but before I arbitrarily decide on a number (as I arrogantly did in my
post), I'd like to like to see what
@Zack does first with regards to the aforementioned demographics.
I'd like to say the following:
I've been wanting an Elysian antagonistic faction in SARP for a long time.
ever since I came on the SARP, the Elysians have felt like the Romulan Empire of SARP. Except, they were already crushed by the time I arrived, which meant I couldn't see them acting haughty, sinister and self-righteous anymore.
So, at some point, I fiddled with ship designs. I was actually making Miharu, but some of the stuff I discarded felt organic enough and I went on a fantasy of "wouldn't it be cool if...". And there I built this idea of racial elysian supremacists whom had built up assets in secret to try to regain independence; I called them the "Malakh". However, I couldn't really piece together how they could again compete with something like Yamatai despite that... and there was also that I had no room in my plot's outline at the time.
The idea unfortunately fell to the wayside. I'm probably never going to have the time to dedicate to Elysian NPC antagonists.
Despite that, I was already very cheered to see this thread existed. But you've all gotten bogged down in a conversation about how it can't happen, rather than how it could happen.
So that's going to be my plea to the people in this thread. The process is likely malleable: how can this be empowered to happen?
@Fred, I agree wholeheartedly with the idea of
Elysia being the SARP equivalent of Romulans, which is why I plan for them to outfit their next generation of (warbird-shaped) starships with Quantum Anima - what I've unofficially decided their new term for
Aether is - Singularities.
Similar to what
@Zack said
here, is there any mention of the Malakh on the wiki or in roleplay? They'd make a great terrorist organization or something similar for
Elysia to devote a plot arc or two to fighting.