So instead of talking about those excellent points, you focus on some imagined "mudslinging" that only exists if you want to view the objective truth that way?I think you bring about some excellent points. They just didn't need to be framed in mudslinging.
Agreed.I'm in favor of having Syaoran as an additional NTSE mod. He's one of the named people I'd have absolutely no qualms seeing in the role.
This is just silly. Not only does this limit input from the public severely, but it forces the NTSE to act faster and gives them a lack of tools to address something that could be missed. 10 days isn't even long. Most submissions spend a week or more in the NTSE because there's quite a bit to read and then go through (especially in your submissions).
Timers and more pressure on mods when we got @CadetNewb saying he feels pressured because of someone he can block and tell a submitter to ignore seems like the most ass-backwards way to approach the issues.
If there is something wrong with or unapprovable about Legix's article then it's any community member or NTSE+Staff's prerogative to go and raise questions about it. Point something out if there is a problem with the approval there. Go ahead.Using the same burden of proof you tend to apply to Cadet and his activites on the NTSE its more then enough to scream bias and special treatment
So if I'm being shown bias and I want to eliminate all bias as mentioned in the following posts... what does that mean?Article posted by Legix Tuesday at 12:37AM and Approved by Ame Tuesday at 1:01 AM, clearly you don't believe your own words. You can scream that it was talked about in discord or other methods over and over again but until its discussed in here and set in stone..... it doesn't count. Using the same burden of proof you tend to apply to Cadet and his activites on the NTSE its more then enough to scream bias and special treatment no matter the complication of the article since you guys tended to do the same over the simplest pieces of tech and hold them up for weeks. This one a corporation passed in less then an hour... and using a more concise method... screams bias and special treatment.
- A deliberate attempt to ignore certain submissions.
- Ensuring the NTSE stop deliberately hindering articles by ignoring them, as has happened to Frost seemingly multiple times as-of-late. As much as Arieg has complained, I again will point out that he has got well near 30+ articles approved in the past few months. This promotes more talk of bias because he got streamlined while some articles have sat in the NTSE for a month or more in that same timespan.
The workload is unbalanced because one side won't grab another's in this mess. The NTSE needs more mods, but giving the members more power is the definitive wrong way to handle this.
I just want people to start figuring out that the real issue is not the players, it's that people are rather trying to fight and argue instead of hear people out or just ignore them. It's on people who refuse to pick up X's submission because they openly admit bias and refuse to even try to work past it. It's literally a thousand other reasons that don't have to do with removing a player right.
Use PMs like you're supposed to and try to keep "NTSE Issues" relevant to actual NTSE issues like the shirking and avoiding of handling certain threads over the threads of friends. I'd love if instead of having to rely on @Ametheliana for all my submissions that @CadetNewb would have actually taken them. I'm sure Frost would have as well, but his threads only end up sitting there for a few months without a reply.
I quoted the original post rather than the one you edited requesting mod powers, precisely because you seem to not realize that this happened to me. I didn't get an apology for it happening until just two days ago. You allowed the harassment to go on there, specifically trying to echo what even @Ira said was irrational harassment and apologized for. But we don't talk about the behavior exhibited there, instead you hone in on Frost. This is why the discussion isn't good, because we still have people refusing to acknowledge the entire issue just like Arieg is doing by trying to discredit me.The thing is, when I first began the job as an NTSE Mod, I was fine with people coming in giving their honest two cents. Always was - it was actually helpful.
The last year though? That's a very different animal all together, and that's what's burned me out. What I've seen is basically a very specific crowd of people always posting in the same people's threads, and always in opposition, and sometimes with the most pedantic pile of bull I've ever seen. Worse, I'm well aware that these very specific people posting in the same submitter's thread over and over again have an axe to grind. It is aggravating that this literal handful of people have abused the privilege - it's not a right - to post in the NTSE, just to get at the people they don't like. Having this happen for an entire year - for an entire goddamned year - I have found that I don't even care if they're very occasionally right anymore.
And that's why I'm taking a break from the NTSE. This has gone too far.
It has been repeatedly demonstrated that this "very specific crowd" you're talking about doesn't have "an axe to grind" and aren't trying to "get at" people they don't like. People post because they have concerns for the setting.What I've seen is basically a very specific crowd of people always posting in the same people's threads, and always in opposition, and sometimes with the most pedantic pile of bull I've ever seen. Worse, I'm well aware that these very specific people posting in the same submitter's thread over and over again have an axe to grind. It is aggravating that this literal handful of people have abused the privilege - it's not a right - to post in the NTSE, just to get at the people they don't like.
We have all seen different tech mods lock threads. We have all seen different tech mods post in already locked threads. We know tech mods can move threads and edit thread titles (that's one of their main jobs). So either you're following @Fred's example and exercising extreme judicial restraint or you weren't trusted with the power (which I know isn't true because you've been doing the tech mod thing for years and the job requires mod powers).And that's why I'm taking a break from the NTSE. This has gone too far. Make the Tech mods actual mods
The fact the Warlock was well-written and I couldn't find any actual flaws in it despite deliberately trying to find a mistake was basically why it passed in seven minutes.Communication and clarity DEFINITELY matters. Again: this is why ALL my things in the NTSE pass fast.
You have the ability to lock threads and I've have preferred it. Especially given that I could have been denied the harassment and the article opened/posted in with genuine input. This is my beef with it. But I definitely agree that people shouldn't be able to get away with it. But that's why I agreed with @Syaoran about a clearer establishment of rules and the enforcement of them. I don't think the NTSE need to get more power beyond that ability to lock the thread to halt the abuse. I just think we need to exercise caution over just trying to throw tons of things out like more power when we haven't had @Fred until recently.The thing you don't realize is, as a mod, I don't have any powers to stop you from being harassed in the NTSE Legix. All I could do was provide the best feedback I could on your submission, which is exactly what I did. Because, the only tool I had on hand to stop any harassment was to lock the thread, effectively either killing your submission in the process or drawing out its whole approval time even more. That someone can be harassed, and effectively get results, is unacceptable.
Syaoran's suggestion of having all posts in the NTSE pend moderator approval is the best solution we've had so far - NTSE mods still see the feedback, and don't have to reveal it to the submitter or public at large if it is dishonest in its intent.
Do you not realize that's just adding a middle man? Again, submitters don't have to pay heed to anyone but the reviewer or staff members.The power we are talking about is requiring mods to look at something, say it's relevant, and allow it.
As I stated and Syaoran outlined, better enforcement is the following.The rules are pretty clearly established, I think. Locking the thread doesn't punish the offender it stops all discussion. The power we are talking about is requiring mods to look at something, say it's relevant, and allow it. I have yet to hear a better solution from anyone. Yes, I would prefer only moderators, the submitter, and relevant FMs post but I am fine making this compromise.
What would your idea of better enforcement look like @Legix?
Fred didn't say I was crying wolf. He said everyone was crying wolf. All the people involved in the petty reporting war. And if anything, if it's just crying wolf then that'd mean it isn't a big issue. I've seen staff act when people do clear rule skirting, so like... I don't really understand the idea here.You may prefer having the thread locked over leaving it open so it is quickly approved Legix, but in the end of the day, that's still being between a rock and a hard place. It's a Catch 22, because either way, a submitter suffers. Tech Mods just don't have the tools necessary to deal with this kind of crap. All we can do is ask them to leave or lock the thread, because this behavior is borderline enough that it can't be reported. Even look at what Fred said - he thinks you're crying wolf.
We. Don't. Have. The. Tools.
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