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Ketsurui Samurai Dissolution

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Why is it always the same people absolutely ruining good things for the rest of us?

As one of two-ish actual samurai rolepalyers (not glorified NPCs or plot devices, and not people who played samurai inaccurately), please leave us alone.
 
I mean. OOCLY I get it.

The samurai are pretty much very difficult to play for various reasons.

They are essentially tools that make better NPCs than PCs.

However, when a door shuts, look out the window. This opens the way for conservative samurai who do not wish to submit. Last samurai style plot anybody?

This opens the door for the samurai to be playable. I'd enjoy the ability to take advantage of this.
 
Lol, what I am saying is that rather then fight it, embrace it.

I'd embrace what fred is doing and was wes is saying. Use it as RP fuel. Use that word count and apply it from whining(because that's what it is when you aren't including solutions) and usenit as RP. Such a decree would probably upset some samurai. Insult them. They'd naturally feel betrayed. Others would obey. The only thing worth writing about is the heart in conflict with it self.
 
CadetNewb said:
From what I understand, the most recent and current portrayals are not accurate to the Ketsurui Samurai at all.
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It's not most recent or current, Cadet and stop taking jabs.

Wes told me he didn't like the portrayal of Ketsurui when I was making mine. This isn't the most recent and current portrayal, this stems from the current wiki article that @Doshii Jun made and nothing else. If we are going to re-establish the Ketsurui Samurai we cannot have someone that changed the setting and broke it in the process running the show from here on out.

The role of a samurai according to Wes is they should be a royal guard and nothing more. Correct me if I'm wrong, Wes, my memory can be faulty. So why not go back to that?

If we could restructure the Ketsurui samurai to be a bit more well rounded and simpler while still retaining some key aspects (which vary person to person I'll be honest) to be very rare characters that simply watch over princesses that could be the solution.

There will be more samurai, do not forget this, that will come after the Ketsurui and I'm not just talking about Fred's or mine. There are a lot of places to go and limiting ourselves to Ketsurui only may have been a mistake. Either way, it's what Fred has handed us to we need to make the best of it.
 
Wes said:
I am not going to say anything different from the wiki. There is no secret Wes-canon.
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There was a secret Wes canon for an entire year. Wes, I need a more substantial reason as to why we were left in the dark for a year.
 
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Ametheliana said:
It's not most recent or current, Cadet and stop taking jabs.
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Okay, he was making an observation based on experience. That is not a jab or an attack. It is not an insult, and degrading such things to "jabs" essentially means no positive discourse can occur.

Other than that I agree with your post.
 

I will not relinquish the role of working on the Samurai until Wes takes it from me.

Nor will I be blamed for what the Samurai "became" because I didn't take an aggressive metarole against characters and instances Wes may have not liked. I'm not @raz.

These events are in motion. They have not resolved.

A degree of deference and patience might be warranted.
 
Doshii Jun said:
A degree of deference and patience might be warranted.
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I defer nothing to Fred. It's not right that someone who GMs for four players gets to suddenly dictate that every samurai PC on the site be ruined for the sake of his plot. So it's ignored. The people who play samurai characters contribute more to the site than basically anyone else barring Wes, so that makes all of this even more wrong.
 
Okay, so


Essentially what you are saying is that if the established canon isnt something you like you are simply going to disregard it and pretend it never happened. I mean what happened to all the previous arguments about the sanctity of the canon? I am only asking to try to understand where you are coming from because this reversal is rather confusing. Please help me to understand?
 
Ira said:
Essentially what you are saying is that if the established canon isnt something you like you are simply going to disregard it and pretend it never happened.
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Fred posting something without mentioning it on the GM board — something that doesn't even jive with existing roleplay of samurai — isn't "established canon."
 
@Fred is what Raz says here accurate? I don't mean to annoy with the questions. I just want a clearer picture so I can field a good solution that will please everybody.
 
I don't intend to really get involved in this deliberation, but there's one thing I can't stand for, and it's this defamation of Doshii Jun.

Stop bullying my friend. I am angry that you're so ungrateful at his contribution. Don't mix my role in this with his.

Doshii is guilty of two things:
He's guilty of offering to help out fleshing out an organization Wes was barely touching for the for the benefit of people like... well, you people. For a good span of time, it was enjoyed. It's no more evil an effort than Raz performed when he took a closer interest in SAINT.

He is also guilty of being made to help out when I determined that I could make what Wes desired with the Ketsurui Samurai be made possible. He gave his perspective, participated in a lot of brainstorming - and still does - to ensure the writting we do is at a certain level. As co-GM of my plot on top of that, Doshii bears a more direct pressure on 'does what we do end up actually being enjoyable, or having a good potential payoff'. Sometime, my head is in the clouds, and he brings me down to earth.

You people can think whatever you want of me as the architect of making a story out of what Wes said wanted to happen. But leave him alone.

*boo* *hiss*

* * *

Now that I've got that cleared up, lets address another misconception.

Wes assumed the latest bit of my plot is in YE 38, but it's actually not dated, and my own plotship is supposed to be a Type 39 Nekovalkyrja Cruiser. That gives strong evidence that current going ons are in Q4 YE39, something I have absolutely no trouble conceeding given that it's at worst a minor inconvenience for me but enables much more credibility elsewhere. Timeline in SARP is iffy enough (our OoC roleplaying time is so significantly inferior to the amount of time we can ICly portray) that I find it can easily be adjusted to 'make more sense'. A small price to pay, that I'm willing to pay.

As for Raz, if he doesn't want to adhere to what Wes wants to see happen, I have no problem with it. Under his own standards, it might make his non-canon? That's his problem. And Wes', if he minds. I don't.

I really don't. Something had to be done. I could do it. I'm doing it. And there are always people that are going to second guess those whom take charge of something. It's just too easy to critique something from the sidelines without caring to see the actual effort and forethought in it. The nature of Raz' comments are usually reductive; he points out something and claims it sucks and then will use that as a platform to prop up his own argument. But I'm still confident with what I do, because I know my own value to the people I catter to.

I've been an enabler for something Wes wanted to achieve; I made a story out of something Wes probably would've thrown out as a SANDRA news article. I've personally never needed the dissolution of the Ketsurui Samurai. I've pointed out when the issue was objected that if Wes wants to change his mind, I can retcon. I have a plan B and a plan C to move forward. I'm not screwed. It's just, if the retcon happens, it needs to be soon because my playerbase is still roleplaying and I don't want to have to throw away a lot of their momentum if possible.

@Ira
Yamatai-wise, I consulted everyone I had to. That's Wes, to whom the Ketsurui Clan and the Ketsurui Samurai belong. And Doshii, since the Samurai are currently under his care. Nashoba was witness to a good part of it too.

I don't usually consult players when I plan things.
 
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Fred said:
Something had to be done. I could do it. I'm doing it.
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People hurt by leaving the Ketsurui Samurai alone: nobody.

People hurt by Fred disbanding them, even though he admitted it didn't really matter to his plot either way: actual players; lifeblood of the site.
 
Except that you need to replace my name, with Wes'. I'm just the one that's doing it ICly.

And, unless you can tell the future, this might actually be a good thing.

All Nepleslians were affected by the Species Restriction Order in YE 29. Huge benefit: huge influx in Nepleslia faction playerbase. Caveat: Nepleslians developped more of an enmity towards Yamatai. (guess what: I'm largely to blame for that too~!)

Setting changes happen. Even when they're planned to happen for what initially are OoC reasons. I'm guilty of being the guy that tried to make it make sense in character while meshing in a lot of story threads/hooks together.

...

You're spending so much effort trying to make me look bad, but you're barking up the wrong tree. As long as Wes doesn't change his mind, this is still happening. I'm just the guy that's good at breaking eggs to make good omelettes.
 
I think you want to stick up for your friend for personal and not logical reasons. But I understand that. I wanted my position to be known so when I rightfully complain about the poor state of things with him in command again I won't be told I should have voiced my concerns sooner. I'm not going to sugar coat how I feel about the way he changed the samurai in a way that was worse for the setting.
 
So basically you only care about your plot and screw the rest of the site. Got it.
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So, basically, unless I say it, no.

What I do know, is that this is Wes' website. Yui is his character. The Ketsurui Clan is his clan. The Ketsurui Samurai are his too.

So, if the guy wants to have something happen to his things, I'm happy to accomodate if I can find a way to.

Why do you think Wes likes running things a particular way? Because there's an experience that he, as Setting Manager, wants to deliver. I can't take responsability for what Wes intends to do with the Ketsurui Samurai and thier playerbase. I'm not in charge of the Ketsurui Clan, and I'm not the person that has responsability of actually considering what happens to the Samurai PC. Though I'm flattered you think I should have as much sway as Yamatai's own FM. But hey, no, I don't. Though I did encourage him 3 years ago not to wipe them out because more could be done with them (story-wise and player-wise). Which brings us to today.
 
The fact is the samurai attacked the Empress in the RP. I don't think it would make sense for there to be no IC fallout over that.

So what's happening is the Star Army, including Yui, has lost confidence in them and is going to start trying to make reforms or get rid of them so it never happens again.

I've asked for a list of all current samurai PC so I can figure out how to proceed, but it hasn't been produced yet.
 
Okay.

So. @raz

This is actually something that is easy to handle.

The Samurai being disbanded is essentially like what happened during the Satsuma Rebellion. The Samurai will likely react in two ways - they will either obey, and disband, the other will probably leave, conflicted.

Essentially this is less "POOF GONE" and more like they are being developed and their story has been added to. The status quo has been knocked on its butt, but that does not mean the Samurai are gone, it merely means things have changed. So if what you say is true, that the Samurai are something you love, then I suggest using it as Plot Fuel, and make another award winning plot.

Many will likely commit group Seppuku.
 
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