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Mecha in SAoY

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On the topic of railguns I just wanted to mention that 'gun' is not a completely accurate description of its performance. The one on the Mindy is slinging 50mm slugs with tremendous force, enough to launch the projectile 30,000m(18.6 miles). That's CRAZY fast. Should that hit an unshielded Hostile at 500m it would likely pierce the heavy armor, liquify the pilot, and blow out the opposite side with shrapnel to boot.

It is informally referred to as a railgun but it's actually known as a gauss cannon.


I point this out because I've seen a couple of references to PA railguns being weak or underpowered... maybe others but definitely not the Ke-M2-W2905 Shoulder-Fired 50mm Gauss Cannon
 
Not really. What must be kept in mind is that armor materials are just as absurdly good as our weapons; Nerimium is several times more dense than depleted uranium, with a greater hardness, elasticity and so forth as well. Due to that, I'd say it would take two or three very overlapping shots at best to penetrate the chest, with the rounds nearly on top of each other. The kinetic energy involved would shake the pilot, but dampening systems and so forth would take care of that. It's only with a headshot that neither armor nor kinetic dampeners would be able to adequately protect the pilot.

When it comes to just Power Armors, the DR system isn't too bad as a guideline at all. It's just very, very shoddy at accurately representing anything bigger, like tanks, mechs/frames and even ships.
 
Nerimium is several times more dense than depleted uranium, with a greater hardness, elasticity and so forth as well.
Okay, super metals are fine. Just remember that hardness and elasticity are at opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to metal. The harder a metal gets the less malleable(elastic, flexible, bendable) it becomes. So it can be super hard, it just won't absorb shock like a softer metal. That leaves the damping system to manage 100% of the incoming kinetic force.
 
'Hardness' and malleability are not actually entirely opposite. -True- hardness, but if you have a material that compresses fairly easy but it hard to puncture, because as it compresses it's density rises and toughens it, then technically you have a 'hard' material when it comes to bullets that still absorbs shock well. Either way though powerarmor have multiple layers, they have layers dedicated to shock absorption and layers dedicated to protection form weapons, they can more than manage.
 
We can argue word choice all we want, but the point I'm making is that the armor is actually worth something. Even a Mindy's chestplate would stop a 50mm, though what would often range from unconsciousness to severe injury depending on GM.

Now, focusing on the mecha, for what reason would you prefer the 'walker' design over the 'humanoid' one @Wes? What do you imagine it doing on the battlefield? We need to all get on the same page here in regards to what's expected out of a frame for the SAoY.
 
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I got bored again.

With luck I can keep making subtle changes and it'll come out looking a lot less Rex. But I know where the weapons are and the size now. Good start.

Chunking everything the fuck up, layering plate and looking at modern tanks is working nicely.

Could do with some more references, though.

I may have Lagrange's first major product: A surface to orbit & NLSO weapons platform.

I doubt Yamatai will buy but hey, what are you gonna do, right? If not, I already have other customers lined up.
 
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Guys? I won't be able to work on this, but at the least, the idea has go ahead from Wes. I'll chime in with ideas and such from time to time, but that's as far as I can go.
 
Hmm... Osakan, if it's NLOS fire support/STS (surface to space) weaponry, why not tri/quad back mounted railguns ala M.A.C Monster? That should let it lay down a hellish carpet of fire. After all, you're already heading close to a Monster in the blocky design.

You want the STS capability to be part of the gun system? Or the ammo? (i.e low electrical charge = ground bombardment, high power charge = anti-ship? or normal rounds = ground bombardment, rocket assisted rounds/missiles for exo-atmospheric?)

The first would be an elegant solution, common dumb rounds, just different electrical "charges", the second is more troublesome, but has the potential to use ammo that can chase enemy ships. Hmm... or even enemy troops for that matter. Lob 4 rounds into an area and let them self seek the enemy!
 
Hmm... Osakan, if it's NLOS fire support/STS (surface to space) weaponry, why not tri/quad back mounted railguns ala M.A.C Monster? That should let it lay down a hellish carpet of fire. After all, you're already heading close to a Monster in the blocky design.

Because its a precision sniping weapon, not a bombardment weapon. I also plan on producing variants with different loadouts. Also, having the extra cannons would require extra legs and seriously compromise both balance and mobility. A major function of the platform is the ability to relocate at a moments notice with no setup time over any terrain type in any weather type and to be able to enter an atmosphere and safely touch down with no parachute and very little fire-support from a ranged party. Finally, another major function is when firing, the weapon "lays down", putting its legs flat against the ground like a tank for maximum stability and digs in using pile-bunkers both front and back. Ideally, this is done near a water supply if possible, which is evaporated in order to keep the main weapon reliably cool for pulsed fire.

You want the STS capability to be part of the gun system? Or the ammo? (i.e low electrical charge = ground bombardment, high power charge = anti-ship? or normal rounds = ground bombardment, rocket assisted rounds/missiles for exo-atmospheric?)

On paper, we already have a weapon that fits the bill: https://wiki.stararmy.com/doku.php?id=lorath:weapons:r88

In theory we can put down a Sakura-class in three clean .99c shots -- or one, if we load the right kind of specialist warhead. There's actually an IC reason for it being developed this way that has nothing to do with Yamatai, but instead the events of the Akahar.

Rather than make the platform an utter jack of all trades, I need to sit down and work out two or three usage scenarios in which equipment changes would be valuable.

On paper, it doesn't use any particularly sophisticated technologies by SARP standards and very deliberately avoids certain technologies -- again, due to the events of the Akahar.
 
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Sort of. I sat down and did some thinking: Most interplanetary defense networks are prepared for a small number of high value targets which are detected from a long distance away. Mechanically speaking, they kind of fall flat on their face when they start dealing with massive numbers (>10,000-50,000) small sized low value high velocity high yield targets.

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We ICly revealed that in spite of the fact Sourcians have been ostensibly extinct for thousands of years, there are still resources and left-over equipment operating automatically. We also saw that left to its own business, a "compound construct" -- a network of a few million constructs, each only lasting a few minutes as part of a higher intelligence that we used to decode the databanks we found decided independently that having evaluated Sourcian attack measure, it had decided to attempt to both close the gap and design countermeasures of its own without consulting anyone -- and only when it was asking for permission to manufacture and characters went over the blueprints, we realised one of the two systems it had suggested we make was a weapon of mass destruction. Think of what it outlined on paper as being given a million fungoes. All at once. All it takes is for a few of them to get through and then not only is there the shock and awe of a WMD but there's a hole to put soldiers down. The Sourcian would in practice, use it as a way of breaching doors. That are actually planets: Crack one side of a world wide open on one side, then use the debris to dismantle orbital defenses and make getting planetside a nightmare. Eventually the rocks settle and then you continue as normal. OOCly, I'd like to think it would create a really good way to try and put an emphasis on soldiers on the ground, not armadas above.

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The outlined replica, codenamed ABYSS would have been putting aetheric warheads on one of these bombardment attacks -- less interested in breaking and taking and more in wiping off the map. The LSDF, horrified (whoever designed this having “fundamental detachment from reality”) -- and as a result, the blueprints and associated materials were destroyed and the project cancelled.

Try to imagine Missile Command and Space Invaders had a baby.

A baby that is designed for a specific role, but software allows to be more versatile because the round can be swapped and the output of the primary weapon can be controlled electronically. So if they touch down, troops already on planet can be supported provided these things are still working.


On paper, ABYSS was the sword used as a deterrant designed as a second-strike weapon. The shield would have been our robot friend up there: Ten or so in clustered areas in six equidistant positions around a given planet for optimal coverage. They have to keep moving so their positions are constantly changing and the patterns and routes are all procedural, making attacking them from a distance or at a range that they can't put up a fight quite tricky since they aren't stationary. Throw in some stealth technology when they're on the move and some incredibly thick armor (they're mobile but they're nothing even resembling fast) and you have a platform that your enemy has to be planetside to hurt, since it can't fire over the curvatre of the earth and the railgun can't operate at anything CLOSE to its full effectiveness if its used domestically, severely weakening the weapon in question. As a result, it goes from being some defensive platform to a boss-type character for players to sink their teeth into which I think could be really fun.

Suddenly, if you want free passage around a planet you're attacking, you have to knock out these defenses sufficiently to make a blindspot or a window in and out.

Men on the ground are essential to this task, which is the direction I think Wes wanted.

If Eistheid's about, I'mma ask him to help me with hull detailing n stuff.
 
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You won't happen to be familiar with Keith Laumer's Bolo series would you? The concept of how your mech would operate sounds suspiciously like how later marks of Bolos operate, especially the Planetary Siege Units.
 
Bolos are "hyper untouchable". I hate that: Its bad (very bad) for roleplay.

I don't ever design anything without a weakness. A wise man once said everything needs a character flaw or its incomplete.

To really succeed, it needs a combined arms doctrine. Likewise, to beat one, you also need a combined arms doctrine. Any single approach falls flat on its face but a pronged approach attacking on multiple fronts of classification can bring one down reliably, even if the process is slow.

A good example of a weakness might be any missile launchers which are tucked inside the body (topside in the back), rather than outside. If they're prematurely detonated with well placed frame-grade gunfire, the insides are unprotected - but to convince it to fire them, it has to be engaging something quite far away -- usually an NLOS target. That's actually a weakness many starships have.

When firing its main cannon, it has to momentarily disengage whatever system it uses to hide itself. While its very very very difficult to spot from orbit (exploiting some atmospheric phenomenon maybe) from beneath whatever its hiding behind, it can be scouted out.

To fire pulsed, it may require an external power-supply and almost certainly requires a water supply: sucking it up and spitting out steam to cool itself because conventional cooling methods risk revealing its position. For repeated high end fire, it requires a stable hardened surface. In a defensive role, this would be a manufactured location like a circular airbase with a big sensor dish in the middle.

Either way it usually has to keep moving once the enemy begins a direct attack. The armor is designed so a direct strike from a heavy anti-starship weapon is required to hurt it. But this also makes it very very slow. Because we emphasize speed so much in the SARP, I think bulky, angry and heavy like a giant wall of furious metal would be kind of cool.

Another flaw might be if it needs to relocate and its picking up thrust to get height before other fieldic propulsion systems kick in, if it doesn't get enough altitude before the systems activate and it makes it 1km hop, its feet might strike the ground rolling it across the ground like a snow-skiier during transit. It also doesn't change direction quickly once in the air: A smart attacker can put rounds down where its going to land and make the ground less stable and thus its primary weapon less reliable.

While its high-end orbit defense shield is designed to recognize high energy discharges over massive distances, it has to be operated manually to defend against a low-end strike from up close because the energy threshold of automatic activation is not met, meaning it might either come late or not at all.

While very big and very mean, it lacks a lot of the secondary capabilities of a starship.

Exploitation's of these flaws require planning from a group using different weapons-types and coordinating -- and that there is an IC precedent to know the flaws even exist at all: classified as far as is possible.
 
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The issue with Bolos is this:

astatic.tvtropes.org_pmwiki_pub_images_bolo___annals_of_the_dinochrome_brigade_4031.jpg

1: They are incredibly boring -- Boring looking, boring acting mary sue equipment.

2: They are designed to be the premier platform of war -- a single weapon that can do what an army does. This is stupid: Every unit in war works as part of a group or in relation to another, that's how war works and what separates it from just a fight.

3: No attempt is made to develop an interdiction platform -- either because the writer has written out all weaknesses or more likely, the writer lacks the imagination of an engineer.

4: They are so vulnerable from so many kinds of attack that the writer just refuses to acknowledge.

5: They all look the fucking same.

6: They're armored with "durachrome", "flintsteel", "Duralloy" and "endurachrome". What is this bullshit? The author obviously hasn't ever even considered picking up a science or engineering textbook or skimming wikipedia to see how technology actually works. Having the flavor text there for someone who wants it and basing it on real mechanisms makes the universe feel more real, and not say, like a cartoon as Keith Laumer's work does.

The saving grace is the AI itself that Keith wrote about.
 
Peace, peace Osakan, it was a simpler, more innocent time with less cynics and critics. :)

Why it was even before the internet!! Isn't that like, from the time of the dinosaurs? :p
 
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