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Corporations Overhaul

F

FrostJaeger

Banned Member
For Reviewers:
Edit: Could this be moved to the Setting Discussion forum, please? I realized about five seconds after posting that I’d posted this in the wrong place. >.<
 
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This talk of which nations the corporations are part of is fine, but what are the rights of the corporation's creators OOC? Are we still allowed to direct things to ensure consistency of what we've made?
 
I'm not talking to you Frost, I'm asking @Wes for a reason. I want a direct answer from him. I may not be active on SARP anymore, but I will not tolerate people taking what I've made and making a mockery of it. At the same time, I am willing to work with anyone that wants to use what I've made so long as we work together. In the end of the day, as its makers, Origin belongs to Kai and I, period, and I intend to ensure that remains the case.
 
I suppose this is particularly relevant to me as my corps are truly independent, as they currently exist in one system which is independent as well....Thus begs the question: While other Corps already have some nominal oversight by some parent faction, as club pointed out, What about those not already bonded to a particular faction? I think the "license" direction that Wes proposed is a solid and valid solution to the "independent problem", though i don't think there was a problem to begin with.

And i don't wear a tin foil hat...
 
CadetNewb said:
This talk of which nations the corporations are part of is fine, but what are the rights of the corporation's creators OOC? Are we still allowed to direct things to ensure consistency of what we've made?
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If there's anything I can add, I'd like to state that the rights, specifically in this demand, should be monitored and looked at closely.

Analyzing history over this rule of "creator rights", we've seen it used as a wrecking ball in times just as much to protect things. A few players who are no longer here once said this rule was being used to hinder them when they tried to absorb a faction, so it seems that giving a corporation these rights is a dangerous slip-up.

However, as a content creator, I do want to re-emphasize that I understand the idea of creator rights. But the problem is that I feel (in the case specific to Origin) that it won't be used productively but to hinder the faction and its assets that have been an integral part to the setting. If you or Kai were to be active, then I could see the idea behind the creator's rights being good and allowing you to preserve the corporation.

However, I will advise to @Wes that the situation with Origin and Creators be taken with a bit of salt and apart. Origin's situation is one more tedious than, say, Zen Armaments potentially losing its creator's rights. In no way do I think ill of Kai and would absolutely love to see Kai come back to run it. But Origin has sat stagnant for a long time and trying to argue for rights on it when its leadership haven't been stepping up worries me that we're setting up a grenade for "creator's clause" to be applied to multiple corporations. Setting the fuel for more potential drama fires is something that should be considered greatly, even in the face of content creators and corporate heads like myself potentially losing our ability to have entire creative control.

The idea that people will make a mockery of what Kai and you, as well as the many other RPers of Origin is a tad bit concerning to me as it seems to be under this idea that you're entitled to stagnate the growth and potential of the corporation for the greedy purpose of simply "it's mine".

Origin is a part of Star Army. Something a lot of members seem to forget is that the additions to this site are intended to be to bolster and add to Star Army. This site is not for selfish keep-away. And as someone who, in the past, tried to work with the company I know that your intent could end up not matching this open-minded statement. It'd be a lot easier as an FM to trust Origin being in the good spirit of companies that have been springing up with how closed it has been if there was a guarantee that you would follow through and genuinely take an active role in aiding the corporation.

I definitely can't speak for Wes, but I do know that @Kai and definitely you should at least be able to make the time to be active within the community. But you haven't tried and (since he dropped his last message), Kai has been seemingly too busy to drop by. I for one would love if Origin was active and didn't need someone to step in and get it kicking, but there's very more I can do from hope than to support the idea that you two are advisors in favor of allowing the setting manager to step in and start breathing life into it.

The corporations (Origin included) do not deserve the lack of attention that can come from someone simply wanting to hold onto it for the sake of being its original creator. SARP has been stagnated in the past from leadership "freezing" a faction or site element. I would be against the idea of allowing it to continue further, even if it forfeits rights that I may one day need were I to ever pass on the mantle of FM of Nepleslia and have Ken-TEC in a similar position as Origin.

EDIT BELOW
There definitely was a problem, actually. Particularly that we have a lot of corporations that have been abandoned before when they went independent or had factions die beneath them. That's why I pointed to Wes' idea being a solution, but also a problem in that it does hinder purely independent ideas. As an independent RPer and a small-corp manager, I definitely agree that it does caused problems for those unbonded/who wouldn't desire being bonded.

I imagine this would cause them to HAVE to be bonded... which definitely isn't very RP-flowing, but far from impossible. Both Nepleslia and USO would likely be able to license a business that's pretty rough-edged. Just a matter of which FM you feel would best look out for you at that point.
 
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I've made it perfectly clear that I'm willing to work with anyone regarding Origin Industries, but both you and Frost have also made it clear that you don't want to. Rather, you two want it for yourselves entirely.I know this is just the argument you're taking because it's convenient. The same goes for your complaint of not being worked with; a token effort to work together followed by whining doesn't count. You want what Kai and I made through all our hard work, but not us ourselves. If this submission is simply another attempt to take Origin for yourselves, then Wes would be wise to stop it.

The consequences are not something any of you want.
 
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I don't want your faction. I want it to be in Wes' hands because I know he'll be open to anyone with good ideas. This discussion and your response are definitely warning signs to me. You seem very paranoid and power-hungry to rein the faction in.

Again: Frost doesn't get the corporation. I don't get the corporation. If anything, Wes does. So please stop the accusations and snapping.

The reality is that when I'd try to work with you, you'd turn my attempts to help away and then did nothing for months. I know from others who have worked with Origin that you've also been very stand-offish. You were content to work for months with Asteria but didn't touch Origin and, despite all your fighting here, still haven't been actively pursuing content with Origin.

You're not producing. You're not creating. You're not facilitating. All you're doing is holding the reins for the sake of it. No one says you can't speak up. But the corporation should be in the hands of the SM since you've chosen to not work with it and Kai is simply too busy to. Dropping threats here is also absurdly shallow and petty, primarily since you're showing your colors.

You're not caring for the faction/corporation, you're just wanting to wage war because your control feels threatened. Produce results instead of just giving your word.

It's very simple and is easily done. For someone who hounded the others because Frost wasn't active, what gives you a free-pass? Why do you have to make this about YOUR company? Just stop and act your age. This isn't about wrestling control from Origin. If anything, it's about ensuring the SM can keep the corporation ENTIRELY open and still gives you plenty of ability to influence it as an adviser. This was something Raz pointed out as the case for him before. Everyone here is conceding to the same treatment: safety and stability to ensure corporations don't stagnate and die like Origin has been doing painfully for years.
 

I hope you still have that lawyer you got for Ed and his pals on retainer, Wes.
 
I think you got the story all wrong Reynolds. We were the ones with the lawyer, not Wes, and we were willing to go through with it. Legally, what we create is our intellectual property, period. But that's besides the point. I had some good times on SARP, and because of that, I want Origin to stay as a courtesy to all the players here. However, I don't want it falling into the hands of anyone so reprehensible, nor do I want control of it being indirectly given to such people by claiming 'Wes has control' of it.
 
Look, I would rather keep Origin on SARP since it gives content to the players here, but you guys are making it difficult to justify leaving here. Especially with the thinly veiled attempts at grabbing it.
 
Any discussion or commentary not conducive to the submission will be removed.

@CadetNewb make a thread about Origin if you need a place to talk about Origin.
 
Currently, the article incorrectly lists Wes as the manager of Origin Industries, not me or even Kai. That needs to be changed.
 
@CadetNewb , in origin's own thread, you said you were fine with Origin turning into an NPC faction on march 7th, and then you left the sight. Of course Wes would go through and have Origin become an NPC corporation, and of course people would assume it is NPC. It's kinda hard to be the manager of something when you're not here.

I have been a member of Origin almost my entire time at this site, and the idea behind the company was great. But it's a ship that has long since sailed, as there has been little to no support for actual RP of the company and it's employees. It's just been used as a set piece. It's technology articles also hardly update. I'm pretty sure there was a point where I was the only person making things for them.

Now you stand here and talk about wanting to protect Origin Industries, but you never protected it from dying out. No one -wants- Origin. They're labeling it as NPC because you haven't been here to manage it. If you want to be the manager of it, then be here at the minimum. If not, then let it become an NPC corp and progress through time, maybe someone will eventually revive it, maybe not. But no one is trying to make a grab for a faction that is right now just a bunch of outdated tech articles.
 
CadetNewb said:
. Legally, what we create is our intellectual property, period.
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Actually, if you look at the terms of service, which is on the front page of the Wiki (See attached image) you can easily find the terms of service regarding intellectual property and user submitted content.

"By participating in the Star Army community, you are granting us with a non-exclusive, perpetual, irrevocable, royalty-free, and transferable license to display, use, publish, republish, adapt, copy, share, edit, distribute, watermark, or create derivative works, including commercial works, from any content you submit (such as wiki articles, forum posts, image uploads, and characters), provided you hold copyright to it. The termination of the license must be mutually agreed upon by both parties. You retain copyright over your Content."

While you may point out this section, "You retain copyright over your Content." Origin industries would have to be copyrighted before ever using it in any Star Army posts, wiki pages images or characters. And after searching though the database of the United States Patent and Trademark Office, Origin Industries is not and has never been copyrighted.
 
Well gosh now you need to define what you think a set piece is, since I won't put words in your mouth.
 
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